From a moral perspective, there is no difference between sexual assault and rape. The fact that we have a legal difference is not something that we should critique the jurors for, it’s something we should critique each other for.
What I’m saying is, I think the jurors did an excellent job. The $5 million dollar mark is the perfect amount, high, but not so high that it will immediately get dismissed on appeal. The finding of sexual assault and not rape makes sense based on the law and the facts. These jurrors have restored my faith in America.
I didn’t think I heard enough for rape but there was more than enough evidence of sexual assault. His MO was exactly what he said on the Access Hollywood tape. I think that is all the further he got with E. Jean Carroll. The reports sounded like she fought back and thwarted the actual rape.
that’s not the standard needed here… only a “preponderance of evidence” meaning more likely than not. Which I believe they should have decided was the case. If they believed the rest of her story, why stop there? I just think someone (or several people) had a bias against rape charges.
okay, IANAL, but since when is ejaculation required for rape charges? I would hope penetration is enough, which I thought she said happened.
I can only wonder if this chips away a little bit at that sense of invincibility. I suspect his supporters will focus on the “no” to the rape charge. They tend to be very good at selective interpretation. I hope that E. Jean Carroll feels vindicated, and some sense of peace.
Unfortunately, even with this verdict and the substantial award, it will not change a single vote. Those of us who believed he was a pervert and rapist before still believe so. Those who think it’s OK for trump to sexually abuse women because he’s the all-powerful anointed of God will still worship him. All the MAGATs will cry that it was a hoax. All the rest of the republicans will change the subject and never speak of it again (and will vote for trump if he is the nominee).
One positive consequence may be other women who were abused or raped by him will come forward to tell their stories.
Well, since he couldn’t differentiate between E. Jean Carroll and his then wife Marla Maples, maybe there is a grain of truth that has no idea who the woman he sexually assaulted is.
I’m trying to rationalize the verdicts – yes on battery and sexual abuse, no on rape.
Sexual abuse in New York requires sexual contact, which just requires touching of the “sexual or other intimate parts of a person” to gratify sexual desire. (NY Penal Code 130.00, 130.55)
Rape requires sexual intercourse, which requires penetration. (NY Penal Code 130.00, 130.35)
The jury may have believed there was enough evidence to prove that Trump was there, and that he battered Carroll and subjected her to sexual contact without her consent. But they may have felt there just wasn’t enough evidence to prove actual penetration. (Maybe it was a compromise.)
In other words, they buy her story about she and Trump being in Bergdorf Goodman and his assaulting her. They’re just reluctant to say he penetrated her without more evidence.
It’s hard to see how this can be construed as a win for Trump. But maybe what they mean is that his followers already believe that he gropes women, so this is just more of that. Sad…
Trump should have a strong incentive to settle this before the verdict gets rendered into judgment. Once it goes final, the fact that he sexually assaulted E. Jean Carroll will become collateral estoppel against him in any other lawsuits brought against him. In other words, the courts won’t allow him to dispute it. $5 million is a small price to pay to avoid that collateral estoppel.
Interesting. Why wouldn’t they have been allowed to consider each independently? Especially thinking of appeals and all that, if a rape conviction nullified even the chance to convict on sexual assault (which definitely had more supporting circumstantial evidence, including the Access Hollywood stuff), that seems off?
There’s no way former Daily Caller employee Kaitlyn Collins is passing up the opportunity to give an hour-long interview to the man found guilty of sexual assault.
From Wikipedia:
In 2018, the group Log Cabin Republicans unearthed some tweets from her time at Alabama in 2011. Collins used the slur “fag” and expressed that she did not know “if I wanna room with a lesbian.”
