Who chose the demarcation line? What was Roosevelt’s preference?
Putin does not have a literal button. “The Russians” would have to carry out any insane order to go nuclear, i.e., commit suicide. And “the Russians,” broadly speaking, want neither nuclear war nor to commit suicide. They don’t even appear to want Putin’s miserable failure of a war in Ukraine.
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Nobody here is in favor of that. Like always you are making shit up.
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Fair enough. We have some, but they are inadequate to meet our current needs. If we go to war, we will need many times more to manufacture the massive number of computers, vehicles and weapons that we would need.
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We don’t know that. I’m pretty sure US and NATO intel know something about the Russian command and control structure for their nuclear forces, and it may not be set up in a way that Putin can just commit world suicide.
Our own system is a bit shaky in that respect, which was a concern during the Trump administration, but as I understand it, there is no red button in the nuclear football that just immediately launches missiles. When an enemy launch is detected, the President is presented with a set of targeting options that he reviews with the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs or whoever is available at proper rank and clearance, and the targeting orders are then sent to the subs and silos. You don’t just say, “Gimme that football I want the button!”
So there is at least one layer of other people involved who might say “Uh sir, let’s take a second to consider this (whispering, get the net!)” for a launch order that was just insane and unprovoked. Of course if the Russian system is similar it would require some backbone from the military, but then we’re back to whether they love their children too. The Russian military are perfectly aware of what a nuclear attack would mean for the world.
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She is absolutely wonderful. Thanks for the link. I’ll definitely watch.
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As any relationship counselor would tell you, don’t use the word “always.” @castor_troy is a valued long-time member on these boards and he’s very passionate about this particular issue.
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Ah, there, the loop argument. If you’re not currently in the military, you’re not allowed to comment on anything because you don’t have skin in the game. If you are currently in the military, you’re not allowed to comment because you’re clearly a warmonger, why else would you be in the military, and have too much skin in the game.
Please. Have Joe call up for volunteers, waive the physical and age requirements, and I’ll be on that fucking plane.
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Totally true. But everyone else would be in the same boat. Also, my main take away is that losing our chip fabs is an insufficient reason to refuse to help when help is needed. I’m struggling with the idea that the US and just as important, the EU, is sitting on the sidelines while people get killed. Ukraine has served as a buffer and ally to the EU and the EU is refusing to get their hands dirty. Disappointing doesn’t cover it.
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No, that’s not possible. Strategic nukes launched by Russia against the US/NATO from submarines in the Arctic Ocean and silos within Russia will hit their targets.
ETA: Jeezus people, it’s like the Cold War never happened and we forgot about all this stuff.
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Right now, however, they may believe they are “committing suicide” if they try to stop Putin. It depends on how many of his top-level flunkies are willing to stop this stupid war.
There must be a tipping point where enough of them band together to stop him. I’d recommend dosing him with a Novichok nerve agent, simply for the irony.
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People were so ready to forget Covid and move on to the next thing, but this next thing won’t last for long as you point out.
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I am not up to date on our preparations, but I would think our intelligence apparatus is extensive enough to know where those submarines are located at any one time. Maybe they couldn’t stop everything, but I bet they could stop most of them.
Let’s hope that neither of us learns the truth.
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ANd I simply cannot believe y’all want a redux of WWI - the entire globe going to war for a country in eastern Europe just because. I think it’s the height of folly to push for war over this. Yes Zelenskyy is a hero and the people of Ukraine are inspirational. I love them and their desire to remain independent. But I think starting WWIII over it is one of the dumbest things I’ve ever seen on liberal comments boards.
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And for those that think I’m being hyperbolic in using the Holocaust for reference, here’s what CBS is reporting:
Dunno about anyone else, but from what I recall of the history books, that reads pretty damned familiar.
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That’s a silly position. Our interests are not the same as Ukraine’s, even when they align.
Have you heard about this thing called the Soviet Union? That was a thing where Russia held together an empire of vassal states through force of arms, a vast surveillance and intelligence state, and brutal repression of dissent and any semblance of human rights. It killed tens of millions of its own citizens, including literally starving to death millions of Ukrainians literally as a state policy. It was really, really bad! Like, way worse than Putin!
Patience.
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This is hyperbole. It demeans the Shoah, which happened in real life, not in the hypothetical nightmares of (understandably) frightened posters – but there’s no network of death camps, gas chambers, and crematoria.
Hundreds of dead and wounded Ukrainians are just as dead as if Hitler had killed them, but this is not (“literally”, as you assert) “another holocaust”. A war crime, yes; a cataclysm, yes; but “another holocaust”?
No.
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Why it has to be always a woman the one that talks sense. It must be excess testosterone that clouds men’s mind.
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This.
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I’m talking about the number of chips we would need to effectively fight a war, while keeping our government and country functioning. Chips are in everything from cars to phones to refrigerators to missile guidance to planes to tanks to tvs to computers…etc. ad nauseam. We couldn’t fight a protracted multi-front war with our current supplies.
It is far beyond disappointing. It is maddening and tragic.
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