House Judiciary Chair Jerry Nadler (D-NY) predicted on Sunday morning that his committee will draw up its articles of impeachment against President Donald Trump this week.
âWe have a very rock-solid case,â Nadler said during an interview with CNN anchor Dana Bash on âState of the Union.â
âI think the case we have, if presented to a jury, would be a guilty verdict in about three minutes flat,â he added.
I might add that Nadlerâs estimation of time included transport to the deliberation chambers, seating, discussion of protocols, vote and return to the courtroom for announcement of verdict.
The Narrative is the Ball.
Josh made some good points in his article about how itâs time to push forward with impeachment now. Among his descriptions for getting behind the strategy, he used some combat and sports metaphors. âKeep your offense goingâ âkeep them on their back footâ âSeize the high ground.â
And I can see how he came to his conclusions. But I differ. While I was among the âIMPEACH NOW â things are moving too slowlyâ camp, I was never âGet it done FASTâ. The reason is simple.
Conventional wisdom among pundits (including Josh) seems to be that conviction in the Senate is an impossibility. Trump will be acquitted. The only question seems to be how quickly theyâll come to their already pre-arranged verdict.
So why the rush?
Anyone old enough to have been out of diapers at the beginning of the âBenghazzi Blitzâ â knows they went on forever. And ever. And never ever turned up âanythingâ. There was no âthereâ there. But it didnât matter. Because the whole point of the hearings was to control the narrative. To keep the Dems, and Hillary in particular â on âdefenseâ. If youâre explaining â yourâre losing. Yes, she won the popular vote â but how many more voters stayed home because the âCrooked Hillaryâ narrative suppressed them? Or voted Stein in protest of her âcorruptionâ?
The Narrative is the Ball.
Donât turn it over.
I still donât understand â specifically with the CW being acquittal in the Senate â why exactly â weâre in a hurry to turn over the ball. Why not keep it, control the narrative and then run out the clock?
Sure â Iâve read the arguments that âKeep it Simple, Stupidâ is the way to go. That the Mueller report was too complicated for the public to follow. I favor the argument put forth by Amanda Marcotte that â as in the Weinstein case â one accusation doesnât make the case. You need to pile on. @castor_troy roy argued âBut thatâs ONE CRIME â over and over. Rape.â Which Iâll concede does sound simple (Itâs not) But for the sake of argument â Iâll go with it. And say âFair enough â letâs pile on â with ONE CRIME â Obstruction of justice. Over. And Over. And Over.
Remember â Mueller kept the lid on his investigation. To the point that his results arenât even available in their entirety. Meanwhile â the Narrative â âThe Ballâ was in the Republicanâs hands. They unleashed their Right Wing Wurlitzer and the Bully Pulpit to pound the airwaves and the internet with âNO COLLUSION â WITCH HUNT â NO COLLUSIONâ 24/7. They controlled the ball â and effectively prevented any real offense from Muller on the field.
At the moment â âwe control the ballâ. The moment it goes to the Senate â the Republicanâs do. And if they spike it â then Trump gets to control the narrative with âI WON - IâM INNOCENTâ
No amount of protestation about having been âimpeached in the house, but acquitted in the senateâ â just like Clinton â will make him seem⌠culpable.
Will âmore hearingsâ after the acquittal make a dent? Some think so. Some say âwe can impeach him again and againâ. But I think Pelosi wonât have it. She clearly finds the process abhorrent. You only get one shot at the King. We should be piling on the narrative â while waiting for the courts to rule on the various cases. We should hold onto the âhigh groundâ and keep them on the defense. If the objective is to depress their voters, enflame ours, then we must â keep his corruption front and center 24/7. Forget the argument that it âdetracts from the Houseâs workâ . The Houseâs work is going to be crushed in the Senate anyway. Passing bills that die in the Senate â is not building a strong narrative. Pointing out Trumps crimes is a much more salacious media dominating strategy.
Donât. Turn. Over. The. Ball.
Pile on the narrative.
if presented to an honest jury,
Fixed it, because we all know how the Senate GOP is going to vote. Itâs all a messaging game from here on out, I hope Democrats are ready for the media pushback that will be required by them when the Senate GOP finds Trump not guilty and itâs best to set up the premise that anyone voting that way is doing so in bad faith.
Letâs stop assuming we all âknowâ how the Senate GOP is going to vote. Instead, letâs find the ones who are in tight electoral spots and pressure them constantly (looking at you, DNC). Find any and and all means to âpersuadeâ them itâs in their best interests to rid us all of this pestilence.
I think Nadler is only talking about timing regarding a possible vote in House Judiciary, not a vote of the full House. I expect theyâll wait until at least Friday to see whether SCOTUS chooses to hear the various cases related to Trumpâs tax returns.
I see the merits of both sides also, but fall on the side of keeping this away from McConnell, and on a slow, steady boil in the House. Thereâs still more to uncover. Parnas, as one example, has significant knowledge of Trumpâs direct involvement, I would presume.
I expect to see an obstruction of justice wrt Mueller investigation -pattern of behavior.
I agree with you but because moderate Dems in red districts are worried, they will turn over the ball. You and I both know thatâs how Democrats play the game.
Horse puckey. Clinton was guilty as sin, nobody doubted that and his acquittal didnât make his blowjob magically disappear. The only question there was whether his personal things and lying about that was enough to remove him.
As it was, he was damaged enough goods that he was sidelined for the 2000 election, and you might remember how that turned out.
No acquittal in the Senate is going to do anything more than reinforce that trumpâs enablers are the republican party and theyâll let him get away with anything.
We do know that the Senate will acquit Trump. 67 votes is a high bar to get over but with this Senate, a majority will vote to acquit.
But the vote will put so called moderates such as Susan Collins in a tight spot. A vote to acquit Trump will be the final nail in her coffin
Bill Clinton was still a very popular president despite the impeachment. Al Goreâs decision to sideline him was a big mistake.
The Democrats donât want the process to get bogged down, either in the House or in the public, by lots of extra information that is mixed in. Thatâs going to build a lot of confusion, and give Republicans even more ways to create nonsense stories about what happened. That makes a lot of sense, reallyâŚthe evidence really is solid, even without testimony from the principals involved, and the blockage of testimony is just another item for impeachment (one that all members of Congress should be voting for to protect their oversight powers in the future). Thereâs no guarantee that they will get anything from the courts to help their caseâŚthe Democrats have won every decision so far, but all are being appealed and it will take months to get through that process. Having impeachment basically stop to wait for a court case, and then getting more testimony, may delay things until so late that no one will want to pursue impeachment in the middle of the election season.
I think itâs worth waiting for the near term court decisions, plus for any extra evidence or testimony that may come out of them. If the SC gives up the tax forms, then the House will get them (any delays after that will be against the law, though I still expect Trump to try), and going through them over the holidays and seeing what is learned makes sense. However, delaying for months waiting for a decision to get anyone in to testify, or documents, makes no senseâŚit really is better to push now without all that. All, when that stuff does come, and when it shows that Trump and the Republicans really did do the things impeachment said, that Trump really has been influenced by the Russians, what do you think happens to the reputation of the Republicans? They will have fought to defend, and voted to clear, someone who violated the laws and tried to cheat in 2020; having a clearer picture in Oct 2020 and a clear decision by Republicans to support actions against the nation will damage them severely in the election.
My honest assessment? We will not get a better shot at asking America to decide whether this kind of misconduct is acceptable or not than we have at this moment. We could keep spinning in circles and running down leads for the next decade, and the folks who believe in the Doctrine of Ultimate Control as exercised by Current Occupant will not change their minds. If we do nothing except wait for more"stuff" to emerge and let him get re-elected without protest or resistance, we will merely have participated in our own demise. So it doesnât matter whether he gets removed or not (thought it would be lovely) as much as making clear to the electorate that this is a matter of grave constitutional import AHEAD of the next election, and inviting our republic to show its hand, and defend its own interests from domestic assault at the ballot box.
Iâm increasingly unenthused by the idea of âgoing smallâ in the impeachment indictment. While it provides a beautiful snapshot of the Trump Crime Machine in action, it does little to provide a broader context. In just a few weeks, perhaps already, the House will have its hands on records of bank loans issued to Trump and Kushner by Deutsche Bank. It will show two things: Just how far the Russians have their claws into Trump, and how US domestic and foreign policy has been manipulated.
This is an easier two-part narrative. Putin extorts Trump, Trump turns around and extorts others. Nadler and Pelosi can afford to wait a few weeks to assemble a more comprehensive articles of impeachment. Moreover, the House should at least signal its willingness to impeach Pence if he doesnât resign.
Oh, my sweet summer childâŚ
I think you and Josh are coming at this from two different moral planes. ânarrativeâ is a euphemism for politics. If you want to drag the process out longer than itâs real purpose needs then politics, in the form of narrative, itâs what you want. I think Josh knows that narrative is about all the Democrats are going to get but he sees that coming differently than you do. Not from a long drag out political roast but from a solidly built, dispositive case that GOPâers will be forced to reject in the sunlight. Itâs their politics not that of the Democrats that Josh must be concerned with. These are the guys that impeached Bill over a joke and went after Hillary for years and came up with Nada. If they vindicate Trump, and they will, it will be the mother of all flips flops. Not just a black white picture of who they are but a technicolor wide screen image of it.
The longer the Democrats take the longer they justify âplaying politicsâ narratives. Thatâs why theyâve not done that. The players on the Democratic side are high wire pros. Masters of the game. Thereâs no reason to keep the GOP on their heels or on their back foot. They have 53 points on the board and the best the Democrats can get is 47. But you win that game in spirit with 47 if you played fare and well but the 53 is the result of gamed refs.
Take a solid case into the Senate. Let the GOPâers nullify it. And let the court of public opinion do the rest.
Do not sleep at your safe house tonight.
I like the fact that Pelosi is barging ahead with impeachment. Itâs barreling down on Trump like an avalanche. The strain on Trump is evident. The Republicansâ bluff is being vigorously called out. Make them defend the indefensible. Make them vote for acquittal. Make them own the horrible precedent.
Let Democrats make this muscular defense of the Constitution and get it over with quickly. At least then they can go back to campaigning on issues of more popular concern, while Trump is left doing his Lenny Bruce shtick of boring his rally crowds reading from the trial transcript and moaning and complaining and ridiculing âShifty Schiffâ and âCrooked Hillary.â
Very thoughtful piece
âI think the case we have, if presented to a jury, would be a guilty verdict in about three minutes flat,â
Unless it were a rigged jury, which is exactly what we have in the Senate right now.