Discussion for article #227376
This has to be a very painful experience for her to share, as a male I will never be able to fully appreciate the difficulty of making such a decision but I can relate to letting go of some one that you love and seeing it’s suffering come to an end.
I know that many people will not see her actions as being borne out of love, so be it. I and many many others DO see it that way. There’s room for all of our beliefs in this world.
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I’ve spent time in a NICU (with a happy outcome, for which I am very thankful). The babies in there have a horrible, painful time, with only relative brief respites when they’re asleep/unconscious. Subjecting even a vegetative infant to that kind of pain, without the prospect that they could eventually survive and prosper, seems to me at best a terrible lack of empathy.
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“Roberts asked her if Davis could understand that others might disagree with her course of action.”
This is the kind of shit that pisses me off…Questions like that. Why does she have to see her personal and private decision, which is totally legal and was necessary in her life, as her and her husband and doctor saw fit, to have to consider someone else’s opinion of her decision regarding her family. That’s a form of shaming I find totally offensive. Abortion is legal in this country Roberts. Women don’t have to answer for the religious objections others choose for themselves. When religious fanatics choose to impede and block access for anyone seeking a legal procedure…they are the ones breaking the law. Is that clear enough…And they’ll still have first amendment rights to bitch all they want.
Roberts most likely wouldn’t confront some Anti-Choice candidate on how others might “feel” about the legal right of women in this country to choose for themselves. Instead, they’d use the “Pro-Life” label to supplant the way they frame the issue, and debate it as if there were no laws already in place to insure legal access to abortion as a woman’s right. That isn’t a debate on the law as it stands, and avoiding that debate because of “feelings” is the real problem.
Again, I prefer to call these women anti-choice, who run afoul of the law that’s the real problem here, and which has been legal for over 25 fucking years. “Pro-life” has always been a misnomer from the start.
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As someone that is against the current US abortion policy, I want to go on the record to say that this is NOT the type of abortion that I’m against. This was a high-risk pregnancy for both the mother and child. It had good probabilities of very bad downside (death for one or both of them) while having a very low upside (the baby was highly likely to be a vegetable if he/she survive).
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Would I be correct in guessing that you are in the minority of anti-abortionists who feel this way? Most of them seem pretty rigid in their beliefs.
Pro-abortion people are rigid in their beliefs as well.
I don’t whether I am in the minority of anti-abortionists or not; I haven’t taken a survey. I would guess not, most of the time I see people being against abortion they are thinking about birth control abortions (that’s what I’m against). This is a case of medically necessary abortion. If every time abortion was discussed, it was a case where the mother and child’s life was in danger, it’s hard for me to see being against it. But then most people can’t understand why other people don’t agree with them.
Safe access up to 24 weeks isn’t “current policy”. It’s a constitutional right.
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If this kind of abortion is OK, then how would you implement regulations that would give women who need late-term abortions for health and/or fetal-malformation reasons the prompt access they need to pregnancy-termination services while preventing abortions for women who want them for reason you think are bad?
No, seriously. How would you do it? Because the reason we got to where we are today is that all the methods that used to be in place for making sure that only “deserving” women got abortions turned out to be disastrous failure.
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No intelligent decent human being would disagree with her decision.
Only a dumbfuck, shitbrained zealot (Republican) would choose otherwise.
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No one is “pro-abortion”
That term is a non-starter. If there were people who were “pro-abortion” then their beliefs would be that every pregnancy end in abortion.
I personally find the abortion of a health fetus troubling. However I don’t think that men should have the right to tell women what they must do.
Men have the right to do our best to prevent pregnancies by using condoms. That’s just being responsible. Refusing to use a condom leading to a pregnancy and then trying to force the woman to bear the child is the height of being irresponsible, criminal even.
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Thank you. Great post. I agree 1000 percent. I respect women for whatever choice they make - as long as they have a choice.
If a woman gets pregnant and chooses to terminate that pregnancy for whatever reason, it is her private fucking business. What a woman does privately with her body is her decision. What do you not understand about that?
Who is advising Ms. Davis? They should be fired immediately! The book release and the abortion revelation–not a good idea pre-election. It can’t help her already slim chances in Texas. “The most loving thing was to say goodbye” is cringe worthy.
Yet, under Texas law, a woman that was in Wendy Davis’s shoes would still have to receive state-directed counseling that includes information designed to discourage her from having an abortion and then wait 24 hours before the procedure is provided and undergo an ultrasound before obtaining an abortion; the provider must show and describe the image to the woman. If the woman lives within 100 miles of an abortion provider she must obtain the ultrasound at least 24 hours before the abortion.
This is cruel. Imagine having to go through that for a medically necessary abortion.
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If Ms. Davis had kept her personal and private business personal and private, we wouldn’t be here discussing it! Instead she uses it (ill-advisedly and unnecessarily) to further her political ambitions.
Let’s not get into the semantics and the effect of words on the political framing. Is or is not “pro-abortion” or “anti-choice” or “pro-life” or “pro-choice”, is just wordplay designed to affect the framing. We talk to each other everyday on these boards, we all know what we mean. If it makes it any better, I apologize for using the term “pro-abortion” if anybody was offended, and I preemptively accept the apology of anyone using the “anti-choice” or any other label designed to manipulate the conversation. No need to give me an apology, let’s just move on from the semantics.
I think that when men and women get pregnant together, that she already agreed to have his baby if possible. I think the notion that men should be left out of the child-birth decision is pure lunacy. Moreover, it’s hypocritical, because no really believes that men should be left out; they are just displaying the same inconsideration that they are accusing the relevant “man” of having.
And the decision to use a condom is quite often a two-person decision. Often times the woman is the one who doesn’t want to use it.
[quote=“chammy, post:13, topic:9805”]
If a woman gets pregnant and chooses to terminate that pregnancy for whatever reason, it is her private fucking business[/quote]
It’s not her private fucking business. As soon as she chooses to go to term we expect the father to pay for it. He is not liable for her private fucking business.
I would defer to her doctor’s judgement. There is a point at which pregnancy poses an unreasonable risk. I don’t know what it is but there are doctors who study that for a living, I would trust their judgement because it’s the best we have.
Have the doctor do some form of statement to her medical file that the abortion was medically necessary, and let that be the end of it. There is no perfect system. If said doctor is corrupt then that will come out in time; in not then it won’t.
NOTE: If there is a doctor who only takes her as a patient for the sole purpose of having an abortion then I don’t mean that person. I mean the normal Ob/gyn who tries to bring about the best outcome of the pregnancy.
Really? Can you support this with any reliable statistics?
Perhaps in a perfect world or in the dreams of staunch pro-lifers. This is not anywhere near being black and white. That’s why we must have choices for the entire shades of grey.
Key phrase here is “I think”. What you choose to think is what will work best for you. But what you think should not have any impact on the choices of others,
[quote=“Darrius, post:17, topic:9805”]
As soon as she chooses to go to term we expect the father to pay for it.
Here’s that “perfect world” thing again…wishing upon a star is for little kids.
Guess I’m missing your intent here, these seem to be nonsensical. Try again without the epithet.
Oh brothers and sisters, sex is a healthy part of any couple relationship. Pregnancy happens, but is less likely for an informed community. We should be encouraging education and family planning not trying to destroy it. Why Xtianists and fundamentalists want to make other’s lives hell is the contradiction that makes no sense.
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She’s standing up for other women, some in the same position she was in…I call that empathy, and her personal experience is a plus on this matter because she can helpfully articulate what is being fought for, for ALL WOMEN. She has first-hand knowledge and I admire her for speaking up for others that are faced with this difficult decision. The decision itself that she made in her personal life was a private matter, that fortunately (and legally I might add), she had every right to exercise. That’s what is fundamentally under assault by religious zealots, much like gay marriage and using birth control is as well.
A woman’s right to have an abortion doesn’t affect you and your family life or your personal choices if you choose to have a child. But impeding a woman’s right to an abortion, certainly does have personal and private consequences, that no woman should be forced to tolerate, as her legal right gives her that choice. She’s fighting for women to continue to have a legal right to an abortion if needed, which after 25 years of bullshit efforts by the political busy-bodies, are still trying desperately to get into every woman’s womb in America. Abortion is legal in the US…has been for decades. Its not something that any woman has to be shamed for…and I’m sick of assholes that try their best to do just that.