Discussion for article #243987
Bernie is a good manā¦probably too good to be President.
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Senator Sanders is a really good person. He was not served that well by his IT staff. Even if data was not saved somewhere his staff still saw the information, and can share verbally what they saw. Hopefully they did not.
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Thereās a reason DWS, former National Co-Chair of Hillaryās 2008 Presidential campaign, schedules these debates on Saturdays. She WANTS less viewers. Come on, Saturday night during prime Christmas party season, the opening of Star Wars, the NY Jets and Dallas Cowboys NFL game? NY and Dallas, the 1st and 5th largest TV markets? Could it be anymore obvious she wanted Bernie to have as few viewers as possible? With Hillaryās lead, this kind of bullshit is unnecessary.
There is now little doubt in my mind DWS engineered the Bernie campaign scandal. For me, being in the Clinton camp, that Hillary is going along with this shit really saddens me. Hillary is too smart to be oblivious to DWS tilting the scale so unfairly in her favor. Hillary is aware the positive press after the debate and who they declare the winner is all that matters, not so much the many debate viewers. You didnāt need to do this Hillary. And Debbie, to paraphrase Denny Green, youāre who I thought you were. Iāll vote for Hillary with the same enthusiasm I had shooting our suffering family dog. I wanted her to win, but not this way. To all Bernie supporters, Iām sorry. Your man never had a chance from the start. DWS rigged this campaign early on.
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So you trash Hillary for what DWS does? The Clinton Campaign is not the DNC.
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I remember getting āsuspendedā for some silly shit in school but the egregious stuff got people expelled. Iām thinking suspending his staffers is the admittance that they are guilty and that means that they should be gone just like the boss. Sanders told Clinton this is what he would do and so he should flat out can them for at least two reasons.
This whole deal seems fishy, so after a brief spanking on the Sanders side, it just needs to be dropped. It isnāt really meaningful and Bernie and his team could all be Boy Scouts and it wouldnāt change a dang thing. He has his rep and Hillary has hers and that is the battle. May the best woman win 
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If what you say here is trueāand many others on these threads say as muchāit is really sad, not at all fair to Sanders, the primary voters and not even fair to Clinton herself. Whoever wins should win on the merits of their proposals and the way in which they convey their ideas to the primary voters.
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Wait, āsuspendsā?
Yesterday he promised to get to the bottom of this and fire anyone that had anything to do with itā¦
Today, itās suspension?
Sigh.
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The DNC initially barred Sanders from accessing the partyās database, but later rescinded that ban. Sandersā campaign has since fired several staffers and Sanders himself apologized Saturday to Clinton at the Democratic debate.
The highlighted is from another story on TPM this morning. āSanders says the DNC Completely Overreacted ā¦ā Which is it ā suspended or fired?
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There are many other people aware of DWS games:
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If you sincerely believe Hillary is oblivious to DWS shenanigans, she is not qualified to lead the country. I was a Hillary supporter way before most at TPM. I still am, but not a happy one.
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Itās funny, but I havenāt seen a lot of Clinton supporters bashing Sanders personally for what his staff has done. What I have seen is Sanders supporters screaming all manner of conspiracy theory, trying to pin it all on Clinton, and crying for DWSās head.
DWS may have handled this with (her usual) ham fists; she may even be incompetent. It does not absolve the Sanders campaign of wrongdoing, and she was within her authority to handle this as she did.
And until someone offers some actual evidence, all the āHillary and Debbie are conspiring to defeat the unstoppable Sanders juggernaut!!!4!ā nonsense is just hot air that makes Sanders supporters look like babbling lunatics.
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This is where we part like-mindedness on the topic.
I too lean HRC. And am wholly against the seeming machinations of the DNC.
HRCās campaign is in no danger of losing to Sen Sanders. Never has been.
Wonāt be unless she gaffes enormously-- or her health becomes an issue.
Where DWS may be titling the playing field (and Iāll go along with that for the sake of this discussion)ā
I donāt believe HRC has her thumb on the scale.
Sheās never been one to employ overkill when a sublime effort will do.
Sheās built the largest, most efficient fundraising arm in the history of (D) election politics.
And sheās barely tapped into using those assets.
And while that may play into the idea that the DNC is doing her biddingā
and by all appearances DWS gives that impression?
I donāt see tacit agreement or a fait accompli to HRCās advantageā
particularly if it were to somehow become public knowledge.
That? In and of itself would be a large enough gaffe to give Sen Sanders some traction.
And the one thing I do count on from HRC?
Is her attention to details that might untrack her campaign.
DWS must go. November 2, 2016-- Iāll volunteer to drive that bandwagon.
But there is no changing the bath-water now-- without giving Ā®s an opening to kidnap the baby.
We (D)s/Liberals/Progressives are where we are-- in the midst of possibly the most important election of many of our lifetimes. One that will shape the political leanings of the SCOTUS for one or more generations.
I enjoy the give and take among the differing flavors of liberalism-- I do.
But letās not go looking for things that detract from the overall message that Ā®s are simply horrible at governing and serving the public interest. That Ā®s are the opposition-- not one another.
jw1
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There is now little doubt in my mind DWS engineered the Bernie campaign scandal
This is nuts. What does it even mean? Jeff Weaver hired Josh Eretsky, Bernieās National Campaign Director who did what he did and apparently ordered others to do so. Someone in Bernieās campaign chose to describe the firing of their national Campaign Director as the firing of a low level staffer. Only Bernieās people had influence on any of this.
Suggesting, as some here have done, that the DNC, or DWS or Hillary had a duty to cover-up what Bernieās people did is ridiculous.
That Bernie did not get the number of debates that he wanted does not entitle any of his staff to access Clintonās data.
Further, Bernieās campaign brought the being shut out of VAN on themselves. Here is the DNCās recounting of the time. Bernieās campaign was --correctly ā given the opportunity to clear the matter but failed to do so in a timely manner:
Ms. Dacey said that her team had asked Mr. Sandersās campaign for more information on what had happened and for details of disciplinary actions it might take.
She said the Sanders campaign had delayed providing additional documentation and information until late Friday evening. Once it did, the D.N.C. restored the campaignās access to its own voter file, āas was always our intention and as we had advised well before they sued the committee,ā she said.
So what I think happened was that someone in Bernieās campaign has an issue with complying with the rules. Rather than saying our campaign over-stepped but we went and settled with the DNC, they filed their suit in the hopes that the narrative would read that they were unfairly treated and that the DNC backed down. That appears to be hogwash.
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Eyes. Wide. Shut. I went through a denial phase also. I am not basing my suspicions on reporting. If you havenāt noticed, journalism is dying. Most reporters today get their information via the internet. Unfortunately, Republicans will be the ones digging to uncover any scandal involved with Hillary and DWS on this issue. Theyāre quite good. You can see what they did with Benghazi, they had nothing but baseless accusations. This is going to be a gift to Republicans. Just watch DWS in this video: http://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnn-anchor-presses-dws-why-restore-sanders-campaign-access-during-active-investigation/
You can see the truth behind her blinking eyes and repeated phrases.
Edit to add: If I set a live trap baited with the most tempting,aromatic food and I trap my neighbors cat, itās all the cats fault, right?
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Nothing about what DWS did or did not do, changes what people in Bernieās campaign did. Most of that is now known is based on things that it has now be reported that they confessed to doing. All of that occurred before there was any intervention from the DNC.
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Benghazi was a placeholder. Until the primary season began. They almost got there with it.
But it was, in effect, their ācry-wolf moment.ā
Now-- you donāt hear anything from Congressmen, nor the RNC about the individual (D) candidates.
Itās now up to individual Ā® candidates to confront HRC.
When the Ā® candidate is selected-- IMO the RNC cranks up the RWNJ-Wurlitzer again.
But it would have to be something that might stick.
This isnāt it.
jw1
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But it would have to be something that might stick.
This isnāt it
Sincerely, I do hope youāre right.
I understand ALL of the Bernie Sanders people are making this assumption, and have deemed it fact, yet it makes no sense. Hillary Clinton is an excellent debater with a firm grasp of this issues. Her debate performances so far have been seen as dominating, and after each one, her poll numbers have gotten stronger. Why would she want fewer debates seen by fewer people if this is where she is strongest?
Also, pinning every move the DNC makes as somehow ordained by HRC borders on Benghazi logic, frankly. She is NOT the DNC, and dreaming of Hillary conspiring around a bubbling cauldron with Debbie Wasserman-Schultz is becoming a bit much. You also avoid the fact that Bernie Sanders is NOT a member of the Democratic Party. He has never deigned to join, so Iām not sure why anyone would think that the DNC wouldnāt be supporting Democrats over non-member candidates, as that is their job basically.
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I applaud Bernie for this approach ā and not over-erating. Itās ok to suspend employees before potential firing to allow investigations to be complete. Going āfull Trumpā without benefit of complete information is not prudent.
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