Hope you’re going to vote Democrat down-ballot. There is, in reality, a big difference in the level of corporate involvement between the two parties with Dems, for example, nominating federal judges who vote against corporate money in politics.
I ran into a lot of rational Germans in the 1950s. People who had gone through tyranny. For a person who cannot do the math that steve is talking about, the idea of tyranny is being ticketed for jaywalking. In a way, I can understand the idea that one cannot be expected to “understand” what one has not experienced, but I did not experience Nazi tyranny either…and I would NEVER place a Nazi like Trump in the White House because of my petulance.
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Dems going for Johnson and Stein at this point are falling prey to MSM and right wing memes about Hillary’s integrity and to unrealistic thoughts about the third party candidates. Check how well the Clinton Foundation rates in assessments of charities by watchdogs that track nonprofits for how much they’re spending on people who need it instead of administration and salaries; the Clinton Foundation not only is far better than other healthcare charities, but as good in this regard as the typically very efficiently run public service charities like the YMCA. A very impressive achievement. Check Hillary’s own platform this year; the Democratic platform, which she had a major hand in writing, is probably the most progressive since FDR. Check Bernie Sanders’ endorsement of Hillary and his endorsements of downballot Democrats. On the other hand, consider Stein’s support of a right wing world view on foreign policy, her frankly eccentric ideas about vaccination, or Johnson’s phobia of any government spending or any public purpose.
This last remark applies particularly to liberals who are reluctant to vote for Hillary or who as of right now feel they won’t vote for her; to fail to vote for this ticket with this platform and this opponent sends a terrible message to the Democratic Party; it tells them they’ll never get your vote, so why bother moving to the left. That’s not the message you want to send. Believe me, I’ve worked in DC, I’ve worked with political professionals, I haven’t had to fundraise thank God, but this is how they operate. Republican “conservatives” know this…if they had a ticket from somebody who was catering to 80 percent of their beliefs but who seemed too corporate and too secretive, they wouldn’t hesitate; they’d take the 80 percent and then push for more next time. It’s how they came to control the Republican Party. If left-liberals wish to exert the same kind of control over the Democratic Party, let’s ealize some carrot is needed along with the stick, and vote for this kind of a ticket.
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There’s more unfavorable polling news coming , folks. A CNN/ORC poll has Trump ahead in Ohio and Florida.
Johnson is not gonna get 13% of the vote and Stein ain’t gonna get 4%. That’s bullshiite.
His level of support is shocking.
If he wasn’t pro-weed, his numbers would be down in the weeds with Stein’s.
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God, it’s pure deja vu. Every four years, long about this time of year (though we’re a week late this year), we get a few bad polls and the the massive online Democrat freakout begins. (Admittedly, I’d be more blasé’ if not for the one in 2004, but christ that was the most destructive flop sweat stench Internet freakout ever. Unless you count Andrew Sullivan’s one man freakout after the first debate in 2012).
Fortunately, we have online tools to help with these little freakouts now. When you’re freaking out, go to 270towin.com and play with the states. And this year, note what happens if you accept that Virginia (Pollster Clinton +7.8%, 538 projection Clinton +5.1% ), Colorado (Pollster Clinton +6.2, 538 proj. Clinton +4.5) and Pennsylvania (Pollster Clinton +6.1, 538 proj. Clinton + 4.5%) are out of reach for Trump. I didn’t pull these states out of a hat. David Ploffle says they’re out of reach for Trump now. I’d really take his word over about anyone else’s at this point.
If you do that, you see that Trump has to run the board of the real battlegrounds, pick up all of the shaky red states (including North Carolina, which 538 persists in coloring pink because of last time despite this), and flip either Michigan for the win or Wisconsin to get it into the House (and jesus god forbid, blood in the streets scenario).
That is, if you can bring yourself to emotionally accept, that she’s really going to win Pennsylvania, Colorado and Virginia, a Trump win requires Trump to win each and every one of these:
North Carolina
South Carolina
Georgia
Florida
Ohio
Iowa
Missouri
Arizona
AND he has to flip Wisconsin or Michigan.
He probably will take some of them. But even if you give him the ones that shouldn’t even be in play–South Carolina, Georgia, Arizona, Missouri, and Iowa, statistically unlikely that kind of run may seem. He still has to take North Carolina (Pollster Clinton +2.3) and Florida (Pollster Clinton +3.3) and Ohio (Pollster Clinton +1.1) and either Wisconsin (Pollster Clinton +5.9) or Michigan (Pollster Clinton +6.5).
Sorry, guys. Much as I love a good freakout, I’m just not seeing it.
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But I can see how it was a lot easier for a Hillary supporter to say “ah, hell, okay” to Obama than the Berners found it to say about Hillary. Nasty and contentious as it got, and I was in the midst of it with a shovel, there just wasn’t a lot of policy daylight between Hillary and Obama, and history was getting made either way.
Disagree. Obama wasn’t running against your crazy, drunk, hateful, racist, misogynistic, xenophobic uncle. For all his and even Caribou Barbie’s flaws, they weren’t nearly as frightening as Trump. There’s no excuse for these people.
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Quick, you better go tell the people that it’s HRC that they should trust:
Hey, thanks for the Clouds & Shadows, I was running low.
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The only problem I have with this is if enough people in CA think exactly the same way that you do (in their belief that it’s a ‘safe’ protest vote), you could see Trump end up winning the state of California. All it would take is at least 1/3 of the electorate to decide to ‘protest vote’ their way through November 8.
Which in many ways is one reason why I think protest voting is futile, since it doesn’t do anything than make the people doing it feel better for themselves, as it lets them believe they are off the hook if the protest votes are enough to sway the election in the opposite direction than they believed their ‘safe’ state was.
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I’m right there with you. Both my kids are ‘good’ Democrats and solidly behind HRC but report back regularly about friends that are ‘conflicted’. They hear the 30 year old BS that the GOPpers have perpetuated about HRC and they ‘think’ it’s the truth. They pine for an ‘outsider’ like Bernie. When I say he’s been in politics for 40 YEARS they look at me like I’m a monster. I went to one of the Young Democrats Meeting with my daughter and I was reduced to play the Supremes card…vote this way or else your entire way of life is over…It MATTERS who you vote for, it really does. I know I changed some minds but not to many hearts.
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Some polls are showing Drumpf ahead of Clinton in Florida and Ohio, and a poll that shows Clinton ahead in Kansas. What is going on?
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Agreed, I think Drumpf has a solid glass ceiling at 40% (max) that he will never break through.
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Almost enough to send you into hibernation…
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Amen…
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I am sorry. I was just responding to plucky’s assertion that progressives will
As if minorities can’t be progressives.
42 is where I put it. Josh is right that if her national numbers collapse her state numbers collapse, but so far, as he also noticed, just oscillation within a range.
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National polls are as meaningless to the election as is the popular vote. What matters is that Clinton is now trailing in both Ohio and Florida according to the latest CNN/ORC poll. The trend isn’t pretty.
But no worries! Should she lose, it’ll be everyone else’s fault except those who insisted on a candidate with negatives that rival the fascist bigot who is her opponent. That way, next time around, the special interest stranglehold on what was once the party of the working stiff will be secured.
Had the Democrats remained true to their roots and rejected the Bill Clinton / Terry MacAuliffe DLC Third Way auction of the party to the highest bidders, there wouldn’t have been a sliver of light for that fat ass Trump to squeeze through. But no, Democrats made Trump possible just as assuredly as Bush made the election of Obama possible.
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