Discussion: BREAKING: Franken Resigns In Emotional Speech, Denies Some Allegations

[arrendis]

First, you have no idea what he’s told the members of the Democratic Caucus behind closed doors—so you have no idea if that context of ‘fair hearing’ was attempted. Instead, you’ve been on about due process and the Ethics Committee. ‘He should have been able to let the committee do its work’. Please don’t attempt to shift the context of the discussion.

Second, any such hearing would be easily cast as partisan. I think any attempt to claim such a hearing as exculpatory would only make things worse. It’s an easy target for the Right to point to and rail about in the court of public opinion in ways that would make Alex Jones angry and bitter at the MSM for taking his schtick.

[thunderclapnewman]

The Democratic party is dead to me now.

The GOP thanks you for your wooden-headedness.

[cervantes]

[quote=“arrendis, post:908, topic:66001”][/quote]

What you say in your second paragraph may be correct, or not, but either way it does not gainsay the fact that Franken could have received an objectively fair hearing.

As for your first paragraph: it’s best that I let it sit there without further comment.

[potomacker]

Gillibrand didn’t want him as competition when seeking the nomination for executive. She learned from one the best as her mentor how to win elections and lose power.

[just_observing]

Yeah you and me both. Good intentions evaporate with the speed of light in this current swamp culture we’ve had thrust upon us.

[arrendis]

As for your first paragraph: it’s best that I let it sit there without further comment.

As you’ve nothing to refute it with, I agree. And just for the record, the original context of your hypothetical:

Now suppose that tomorrow Gillibrand is accused of having done something nefarious. Would you demand a fair investigation from the Senate or would you say, as you do above in Franken’s case, that

we can talk about due process until we’re blue in the face, but 50% of the ethics committee [is] never going to do anything to exonerate this [woman]

and that therefore she should take her lumps and leave the Senate?

Shall we go back through the rest of it to establish the repeated use of ‘due process’ and references to the ethics committee, then, or would you like to stop moving your goalposts?

[wordtoyamamma]

Look in the mirror snowflake, and stop yer fucking whining about the mythical Bernie Bros. Clinton Inc invented to discredit him with minorities and women. GOP level tactics.

[joelopines]

The Democratic party is dead to me now.

Then reason and thought are dead to you. You’re not even throwing out the bathwater—just the babies.

[daulphin]

Sorry it disgusts you. As a lesbian, I have found it to be true. Some Democrats give a damn, others treat us like we’ll vote for them no matter what, as we have no other choice. Don’t know where you live or have lived, but that’s been the reality of my political experience for the last 42 years. They are better now, in the last 5 years, but they sucked big time, nothing but words for us for many years. It was never the right time to push for this bill or that one. How many times have we heard “maybe next congress,” “maybe next year”. Seems MLK Jr. had something to say about that.

And where the hell were they in their messaging when Reagan was elected by claiming “welfare queens” were collecting $150,000 a year when he ran in '80? I saw very little push back on that racist dog whistle. No Democrats were pointing out the racist shit Nixon peddled, and Reagan was peddling. Not in any meaningful way.

Not denying the power of the Civil Rights Act, I am talking how much help we have received as far as non discrimination in jobs, housing, and the amounts of violence experienced for simply being in the 12 states in which I have lived.

Speaking for myself, and my experience and why I won’t join their party. I do vote Democrat most often due to lack of choice, but I abhor their inability to get together and make anything happen.

If your experience has been different, I am ecstatic for you. But you no more speak for all black women than I do al lesbians, and I know several women of color and many gay men who, well, let’s just say, are as disenchanted, as I am.

[ajm]

Face reality. Berniebros got rolled by Russian bots.

[playitagainrowlf]

Sorry it disgusts you. As a lesbian, I have found it to be true. Some Democrats give a damn, others treat us like we’ll vote for them no matter what, as we have no other choice

Sorry that you feel your voice is stifled, but to me the appropriate response is not to withhold your vote, which in a close election is equivalent to voting for the other party. The one that wants to you know, revoke your civil rights. It’s to get involved at the precinct level, make yourself heard. After all, it wasn’t Republicans who gave us the Civil Rights Act of 1968, or Rowe v Wade, or Obergefell. So, I personally am happy to concede that the Democratic Party is seriously flawed (which is why I remain an Independent), but I also recognize that withdrawing from the field is what gave us Trump (and just might give us Roy Moore next week).

[wordtoyamamma]

There is no such thing as Bernie Bots, that is the point. It was a fabrication of Clinton Inc., so stop pulling that red herring out your butt on everything.

[becca656]

As I recall, the indictments and charges were supposed to surface in October. The topic here, I thought, was the progress on the Mueller hearings. Didn’t know that Virginia and the other special elections were part of the equation.

And, to be frank, my expectations were set by commenters on TPM because Lord knows we get no salvation or hope from the MSM.

[ajm]

Yeah, right. That guy in Nevada was just moving that chair. Which, of course, explains why he received a group hug.

The original sulky Berniebots is Bernie himself.

Next you will be denying the existence of Russians.

[daulphin]

I promise I didn’t and don’t withhold my vote, I haven’t missed an election since I registered, as an Independent, the day I was able in 1975. ( Not even an election for dog catcher.

In my family of origin, if you don’t vote, you don’t get to have your political opinions heard. I do vote Democratic, in fact I can’t honestly remember ever voting for a Republican. But I do it knowing they likely will not keep their promises to us, as LGBT people and over the years, that has been fairly true.

The Civil Rights act of 1964 shouldn’t have taken that long, Roe v Wade wasn’t a legislative achievement, and we are having a hard time hanging on to it in many places, (Texas, anyone?) as Democrats have no ability to message, nor was Obergefell a legislative achievement. Democrats got on the program for marriage equality, after we had challenged and won a few states, and they saw the tide turning, most wouldn’t talk to us in the late 70’s through the 2000’s with hemming and hawing. Now you can’t goto a Pride Parade without seeing every Democratic candidate, and in few liberal areas, Republican ones as well.

[squirreltown]

I promise I didn’t and don’t withhold my vote, I haven’t missed an election since I registered, as an Independent, the day I was able in 1975. ( Not even an election for dog catcher.

I’m really really glad to hear that, it’s the way to think IMO. But you just spent six paragraphs trashing the only party that even remotely cares about you and your future. Look at the landscape. When we are back in power you can bitch to your hearts desire and should, repeatedly. But now? That actually doesn’t help because your opinions will influence others. We’re all in the same foxhole here, lets get back on top first. You have no faster way to where you want to be.

[daulphin]

I only bitch here. A woman has to have somewhere to complain when the see a party doing something stupid, no? Or should I just sit in the corner and shut up? And I do have issues with what they have just done to Mr. Franken. As woman who was raped and molested and tired of seeing good men who learn from their mistakes, and even have the capacity to be embarrassed by them, tossed out with trash who don’t and won’t .

I spent the ENTIRE damn election year trying to tell people not to falsely compare the two parties, that one has problems and the other IS a problem, and that to equate Mrs. Clinton’s speaking fees with Trump’s corruption so I’m going to take my ball and vote third party was stupid.

I fought for Mrs. Clinton with everything I had and am. Hours and hours and hours of time. Money, we don’t have.

I haven’t posted here often, so I know you have no way of knowing who I am or what I think. I do have a Disqus profile under the same name, and it’s open, so you are welcome to go take a look. I think you’ll find we are pulling for the same things.

[squirreltown]

I only bitch here.

Me too. And I agree with everything you just wrote. If i seemed to jump on you, that was not my purpose at all. Thanks for taking it so well.

[daulphin]

I do my very best to assume good intent until proven otherwise. Particularly when posting where I am not familiar with the usual cast of characters Thanks for a good conversation.

[playitagainrowlf]

Roe v Wade wasn’t a legislative achievement, … nor was Obergefell a legislative achievement.

Agree on both counts, but as the Republicans are quite aware, when you’re the party that holds the Presidency, you get to nominate your candidates for Supreme Court justice. And if you’re the party that controls the Senate, you get to block those nominations. So, if we want more Roe v Wades and Obergefells, we’re going to need to be the party in power in both the Presidency and the Senate (and the House would be nice, too).

So, it does sound like we’re in violent agreement. I, too haven’t missed an election (my first I was just 18 and living overseas, but as with your family, in ours if you don’t vote you lose griping rights, so never missed one yet).

I think our first goal this cycle will be to stop folks from giving in to despair. Then it’s to help them realize just want what an amazing opportunity the Drongo-Donnie Clown Circus has given us. With just a little nudging and a couple of nice breaks we can really make this a blow-out, we just have to help as many people as possible show up!