Politics In America Has Changed And We Need A New Way To Talk About It | Talking Points Memo

Have been saying this since the 2016 Rebub debates: not one person on this stage can attack Trumppp because they all share his beliefs/ideology.

And that is IT btw-repubs have no policies foreign or domestic. They just talk about the problem with brown people and the fact that any woman any day can just waltz off the street and get one of those awesome abortions and they have nothing else. Totally fine for some, but you can’t run a country of 310m+ people without some fucking idea of you know, how to run a country.

2 Likes

I struggle with this, but ultimately, not everyone is a policy wonk. We are fortunate to have some knowledge in this board, but I personally know nothing about policy formulation and implementation. The problem I have with your friend and her ilk is that they KNOW EVERYTHING AND HAVE ALL OF THE ANSWERS because they saw it on teevee. STFU please and let’s acknowledge that there is a lot that we do not know.

I just stopped doing this with clients because even super-smart people mostly respond by saying “well, this is not a property deed, it is a license for a product”…and l worry that they think I do not know the difference because my brilliant ANALOGY confused them.:disappointed:

Setting aside I find it inconceivable the majority of Americans would want to declare a national religion (which sect rules the Catholics, Methodist, Mormon?), there is nothing in our constitution preventing it if that is what the vast majority wanted. There are super majority requirements and state ratification requirements but it could be done if that was the will of the people. The hope is that the vast majority of Americans were not brought up wanting to persecute or infringe the rights of anyone and follow the golden rule. That’s the hope that most people will support rights for marriage equality, sexual freedom, reproductive freedom despite maybe not needing that right for themselves. Laws are written by the majority.

I appreciate the point the author is making here, but I think it errs by skipping past the arguments made by people like Ian Millhiser when he talks about packing the Supreme Court - we are now at a place and time when a true democratic majority can and will be prevented from governing by a minority of people hellbent on preventing true democracy.

We’re now in a situation where it’s a given that the Democratic candidate for President will need to win by more than 2 million votes in order to secure an Electoral College majority, and where it is widely assumed that, if Mitch McConnell remains Senate Majority leader (which he could easily do even if/when the Democrats vastly outpoll the Republicans in total Senate votes) he will not only block any and all legislation from passing, but won’t even confirm cabinet picks or judges.

The author writes: “I find myself looking beyond a candidate’s policy preferences and paying attention to whether their plans for implementing their agenda will help or hurt our democracy. I believe it’s not enough to win. We have to think about the process and structures we’re leaving in place for the next person, whose policy views we may not agree with. I want to know what candidates will do to prevent the emergence of another president like Trump. How will they make sure our checks and balances work so that someone can’t blatantly disregard norms?” It is entirely possible that the next President will be able to do NOTHING to change processes and structures unless they violate some of the old norms.

I agree that this scare me to death. Rare indeed are the moments in history when people find out they can break the rules to accomplish their goals and then subsequently reinstate the rules.

But it’s an asymmetric time. One side is consciously and deliberately ignoring democratic structures, processes, and norms to maintain and expand their power. There is a chance they will succeed. Stopping them is more important than anything else.

7 Likes

Yeah I agree with you totally. I think the author is missing the real point here - this situation is the result of the minority being allowed to be in charge of the majority. And the minority in this case might as well be the population of Germany in the 30s - they are not interested in democracy. So our only only choice here is to defeat them thoroughly. They are defeated thoroughly or this country, this Republic, this democratic dream is over.

8 Likes

Catholics. You’re welcome.

1 Like


From 2,800 miles away…

Yeah… and here’s my point. As I stare out across the beautiful blue Pacific… I view Washington Politics In America the same way I always have.

hobson%20b%20250

Just as the author Aditi Juneja stated after all that 1000 wordy intro…

I find myself looking beyond a candidate’s policy preferences and paying attention to whether their plans for implementing their agenda will help or hurt our democracy.

~OGD~

1 Like

In my state it is also a state and school holiday. Starting before 8 tomorrow morning I will end up jamming five days of work into four.

The NM gov signed a bill that has changed Columbus Day to Native American Day here in New Mexico. Still a holiday but different emphasis, different priority.

And I like it.

3 Likes

This thread could be useful for a discussion for a class in logic. Analogies are great rhetorical devices, but others take them literally. That leads to straw men and more illogic.

Agee, but my fear is that it might move the needle in favor of Dear Leader.
Recall how Himmler created horrific anti-Semitic propaganda depicting Jews as conducting all sorts of despicable practices. Jews in films and posters were depicted as rats and monkeys. Films like this latest Trump film is an analogue to the propaganda of that period little more than one lifetime ago.

2 Likes

I think I might agree with you. Please define exactly who needs to be defeated.

Trump, Trumpism, the people who elected him, evangelicals and populists - the GOP.

1 Like

Unfortunately true for this article.

I was where Adita currently is about 10-15 years ago, thinking that a lack of understanding and common ground was what prevented conservatives/republicans from at least reaching compromise with liberals/democrats.

Then I lived through 8 years of all-out war by conservatives on Obama.

And then 3 years of Trump catastrophe so far.

I watched regular GOP voters cheer Trump doing the same things (and much much worse) than they accused Obama of doing. Besides “triggering the libs”, I’m not sure there is core conservative philosophy to the modern day GOP as they seemed to have forsaken every supposed principle to lavishly support Trump.

What common ground can be had with people whose modus operandi is to literally hate your guts?

6 Likes

I would love to see that!

I agree this isn’t about us waiting for a “coup,” it’s about them staging a mutiny : - )

2 Likes

Not a division between left and right, it is true.

It is now a division between left and wrong.

No, this is not “sowing dissension” or some such, it is a recognition that only one side recognizes the rule of law. Period.

Journalism needs to take a deep look into itself and adopt new ethics and practices. No, both sides aren’t equally valid, with the truth lying in some imaginary middle. Journalists need to be able and willing to call lies what they are, and to refuse to promote propaganda. Unless they do this they privilege lies and liars as they have been for a quarter century now.

6 Likes

x gazillions

Love the comment.

Mort Saul used to say that most Americans were right wing social democrats. Probably it is still the same in spite of the noisy right and left. The country has really changed for the better in my lifetime and these three bizarre years of Trumpism will not change that. Demography is destiny don’t be afraid.

2 Likes

:slightly_smiling_face:

Thanks for that - it helped.

1 Like
Comments are now Members-Only
Join the discussion Free options available