Discussion for article #241913
“Islam does not consider people of other faiths as ‘infidels,’ and does not advocate violence against them,” according to the ISBA.
I’m very sorry, but Dr. Ben Carson, a noted authority on the Islamic Faith, would disagree with you.
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Meanwhile this is perfectly acceptable
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“According to a guide on terrorism and religious extremism from the Islamic Society of North America, infidel is not a correct translation for Karif, the Arabic word used on the hats.”
It’s tough enough being a bigot without having your Islamophobia getting lost in translation.
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Talk about revolting: they charge more for the top end faux Arabic embroidery than for the basic culture-mocking ballcap.
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It’s “kafir,” not “karif.” Just sayin’… And it’s more appropriately translated as ‘unbeliever.’
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You can be ecumenical since they go great with Levis jeans.
I was going to say. Those hats don’t say Karif. I’ll buy a stylized Kafir.
Yeah, I’m not sure where “Karif” came from. My 1300-page Hans Wehr dictionary doesn’t show any words based on K-R-F (well, other than “karafs” - meaning celery). Any real good Arabists out there? I’d hate to think that the Islamic Society of North America messed up something this easy; maybe it’s a very obscure religious term?
I’m shocked; shocked, I say. Sears is still a thing? Who knew?
I assume that “karif” is just a typo, as in the next sentence of the same document the word “kuffar” (K-F-R) is correctly used. Anyway it’s right to say that “kafir” means “unbeliever” or “rejector” or “denier” and has meanings outside the usual religious context. Nor are Christians (who the hat-wearers presumably are) seen as “kafir” in any way, shape or form — they are members of a protected religion whose prophet, Jesus, is also a prophet of Islam. “Kafir” is a term reserved for those who deny religion altogether, preferring darkness and superstition, magic, idol worship and so forth. Finally we mustn’t forget the famous Qur’anic injunction that “there is no compulsion in religion” (2:256) meaning quite simply that religion is a matter of individual conscience, between the person and God, and it isn’t for any human (even the Prophet himself) to impose it or force it on anyone who refuses.
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Sears is still around?
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Maybe the folks at the ISBA feel this way, but they’re kind of outnumbered and seriously out gunned by a lot of folks across Africa, the Middles East and Central and South Asia.
That being said, pretty dumb move on Sears’ part.
Maybe. But we’re not a Muslim majority state. Might want to consult with how contemporary Iranians, Saudis or Pakistanis view this.
“Islam does not consider people of other faiths as ‘infidels,’ and does not advocate violence against them,” according to the ISBA."
That’s a lie: that is precisely what the word “kufar” means: infidels. Jews and Christians are “people of the book” but they are not equals for Muslims at all, since they insist on keeping superseded and “imperfect” revelations. I won’t speak to the violence part and leave it to up EmoProgs to believe terrible things about me, but the fundamental issue of what “kufar” means is what I’m talking about.
The letters on the hat are a K, a long space, A (most likely a short one), F, R.
As you know, in Arabic, they don’t really believe in putting the vowels into the words in writing.
I was an Arabic linguist in the Army, back in the day. There’s a loooong space between the K and the A, which is sometimes done stylistically, if it was handwriting, I would think it was an S, but typed, there’s going to be a few squiggles in there. So there most likely isn’t an S in there.
In the three states you chose, people are overwhelmingly (99%+) Muslim so there may not be much of a religious liberty argument there (except for a few atheists who tend to lay low). But regardless, there’s a difference between what the religion says and how states apply it. If we see a lack of religious freedom in conservative Muslim states (as I certainly do!) then we should be criticizing the state’s reactionary take on the matter, not the religion itself. I’m saying there is room for progressive reform in such states, based on Islam’s OWN principles as expressed in the Qur’an and life of the Prophet. Naturally this is just my opinion, but it’s based on several years living in Morocco, a somewhat more moderate Muslim nation, and conversations with many Muslim friends over the years who were raised within such societies. I can say that without exception, the people I spoke to expressed that what to believe, or even whether to believe is a personal matter that only God can judge. The state’s laws, however, may not be so tolerant.
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Yes, the Arabic on the hat spells “kafir” correctly.
They misspelled “INFANTILE”
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I guess that’s why one still can’t get too browned-off by old, mainline Protestants. But the best solution is to still get rid of all religion.