Discussion: Schiff: Amash Isn't Enough To Count As Bipartisan Support For Trump Impeachment

TPM Article Topics
21

Who says?
Because the GOP Senate won’t vote for it?
The assholes of the RW GOP base are going to vote for Trump no matter what, whether he is found to be Jack the Ripper or Saint Francis of Assisi. If criminal activities are shown to have occurred that warrant impeachment and removal, and the Dems in the House vote for impeachment with absolute proof of criminality, and the GOP Senate refuses to hold a vote or even votes to support Trump against the proven charges, do you honestly believe Dems are going to stay home on Election Day 2020, saying, “Gee, Donald Trump has been proven to be a criminal, but I am not going to get fired up and vote and campaign for Democrats because, well, those guys in the GOP Senate didn’t agree with them!”

Some people on this site have been watching too many of those asshole “bothsiderist” pundits on the Sunday talk shows!

4 Likes
22

hahahahaha No shit = will no one think of Keith!?

4 Likes
23

What are we waiting for?

3 Likes
24

A stab in the dark: You’re talking about a “mainstream” journalist.

 

Another wild guess: You’re talking about the House leadership.

1 Like
25

While we all think Trump should be impeached, the majority of Americans don’t because they don’t understand what has transpired. That is because the Republican PR machine and Barr have and continue to successfully message ‘nothing to see here.’

Democrats reading the Mueller report for 24-hours on C-Span is not enough. In fact, it was silly.

The Speaker and various members of the House Democrats need to, on a daily basis, hold press conferences to examine the contents of the report in detail, with reporters asking detailed questions. Allow a vetting of each issue up to and on the edge of the redacted portions. There are members of the House, Schiff being one them, who know what is behind each and every redaction.

Secondly, the Democratic Party needs to launch a massive media campaign to counter the Right on the Mueller report. I don’t know of too many Republicans who are willing to support a government that has been cozy with our long time ‘mortal enemy’, the Russians. Hold their feet to fire and make them stammer on camera. Tom Styer is not enough and in some ways, counterproductive.

Lastly, when our conservative friends try to tell us the Mueller report has exonerated the president, we ask them if they have read the report. When they tell us no, we suggest they read the report before they try to speak to its content. We will not have a conversation with those who have not read it, but we do ask them to read it so they realize what went wrong. We offer to buy them a copy on Amazon and have it sent to them.

But, even more telling, and why I think we have to step up our collective game on informing the average American, is because so many have not read the report. All they hear is what the right is telling them. It’s too easy to hear not ‘No Collusion’, No Obstruction", and believe that it is all a 'Hoax."

The time to strike is now. If the Federal Judge releases the Flynn information, and allows part of the report to go public, and with the report today regarding Trump and Deutsche Bank fraud alerts

it will not be hard to reconstruct the lost story that the entire campaign was to win approval from Putin to build Trump Tower Moscow, and it is ongoing. And, to facilitate that effort, the president and his family committed crimes to ultimately benefit themselves. And they still are.

20 Likes
26

It starts in the House so yes, but really a fun game for any Democrat to play. Probably the only way to grab the media’s attention as they don’t do nuance.

1 Like
27

For impeachment to help the Democrats in the 2020 election, and not backfire, there has to be clear evidence of a crime that can be “sold” to the American public at large as a reason for impeachment. We’re not there yet.

Everyone in this room understands that obstruction of justice is a separate crime, and can be charged even if no underlying crime is proven. But the public at large doesn’t understand that. Many of them would probably think that’s unfair.

And yes, the House can impeach without a crime in the legal sense, based on clear obstruction of the oversight role, the power grab with the National Emergency, any number of other things. But without being able to sell it to the public, it could easily backfire and harm us in the 2020 election. That’s the political calculus Pelosi and Schiff are working with, and I agree with it.

If further information can be discovered, like Trump being massively in hock to the Russians for loans, or money laundering, then that might tip the scales. But it has to be something big, and easy for the public to understand. A “process crime” like obstruction of justice, or violation of campaign finance law, won’t cut it.

10 Likes
28

Perhaps we can find out someone, somewhere gave tRump a BJ. That should do the trick. It worked twenty years ago. All the rethugs were on board.

3 Likes
29

Keith Richards looks pretty good for a guy who died in 1978.

12 Likes
30

Just reference BC’s bj from ML, and they might start to get it. If getting a bj is a crime, we’re all fucked! Well, a good healthy portion of us, anyway, and i do not consider myself a criminal!

31

There is no crime necessarily involved in impeachment.
Abuse of power, obstruction of justice, malfeasance or misfeasance in office, and other acts of presidential misconduct may rise to the level of a crime, but even absent rising to that level, impeachment can still take place.
That’s why “high crimes and misdemeanors” is not defined in the Constitution.

Congressional hearings that publicly expose the reasons impeachment should take place are the best way to get the public support necessary—but no actual criminal act is required.

And when the GOP impeached Clinton for lying about a blowjob and he ws not convicted, they suffered no serious setbacks in the next election cycle.

16 Likes
32

Schiff responded. “We see no signs of that yet.”
oh it’s coming
wait for it:

33

Yes, I said no violation of the law is required. The problem is that every article of impeachment that isn’t tied to an actual crime, is very easily portrayed by the other side as just politics as usual.

Blocking subpoenas? It’s those nasty Democrats on a fishing expedition. Declaring a National Emergency when there is none? Well, those nasty Democrats won’t give Trump money for the Wall, so his hand was forced.

For every legit reason for impeachment without an actual crime, there is a corresponding spin. But you can’t spin an actual crime like money laundering, or Conspiracy to defraud the United States (if it can be proven). That’s black and white, and there would be far more public support for impeachment.

4 Likes
34

most of Maine is done with Collins.
problem is out of state money she’s getting to build the war chest for all the illusions coming to the population every way possible
for now she in a lock box somewhere hiding.
It’s a believe it or not game.

2 Likes
35

The reason why I bought up the ‘moderates’, is because these guys are likely going to vote for acquittal and they should pay for doing it.

However, it’s going to be interesting to see if voters resolve gets hotter (?) after a (possible) post trial period.

3 Likes
36

Monday morrning I’m going to call my Senators and Congresscritter and ask the staff if the member has read the entire report. And if they say yes, I plan to ask about their position on some particular detail, one of threads, not the “should he be charged” or the impeachment question. Trump and company are trying to stonewall around their “no collusion!!!” line, but that doesn’t mean constituents and journalists can’t just forge ahead into what it says anyway.

The cat’s already out of the bag, no matter how hard they insist it’s not standing in front of you meowing loudly.

4 Likes
37

Seems everyone is running full steam towards the cliff.
we will see who the survivors are when the smart ones stop before going over the edge.
Trumps shown all he’s got and is way past repetitive and boring
I do believe when voters start screaming as the election gets near,
McConnell will rethink the GOP strategy to save his power grab and trump won’t be part of it.

3 Likes
38

I didn’t watch the interview (I don’t think I have the stomach for it), but damn, couldn’t he have said, “This is the beginning of the GOP support we say we need”, instead of completely downplaying it?

2 Likes
39

I’m afraid you’re right. But the dam is leaking badly, isn’t it. Thank you @texastwostep for the NYTimes article about Duetchbank not only ignoring and covering up suspicious activity reports on Trump and Kushner, but actually firing someone who (internally) questioned the stance. She’s only one of multiple sources, by the way.

Bottom line, DB violated their own policies to allow executives in the private banking division to kill multiple alarming, internally-generated suspicious activity reports, rather than pass the info on to federal authorities. Political figures are actually tagged for more scrutiny, by the way, not less.

3 Likes
40

He really is and that’s going to end up being deadly for him.

4 Likes