Discussion: NYT Editor: I Was Wrong To Criticize Witnesses Who Backed Up Darren Wilson

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Discussion for article #234583

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Okay so let’s revise it to “Unarmed, don’t shoot.” There, feel better?

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It takes a big person, an empathetic person and someone who can really soul-search to admit to being wrong on something so important. Thank you. I think thomasmatthew above has it right: “Unarmed. Don’t shoot.”

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That’s great that the person admitted they were wrong.

Waiting for them to report the police department was wrong for being racist

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It depends upon your definition of ‘hands’ and "up’ is.

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Whatever. An unarmed man is still dead. Perp walks.

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There are plenty of cases in which “unarmed” persons attacked police officers, disarmed and shot officers with their own weapons. Being “unarmed” doesn’t make a person not dangerous.

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Define “plenty” please. It’s such a vague word.

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Granted, that also does not give the cops license to shoot an unarmed person. don’t the police carry pepper spray and tasers, billy clubs, etc.? Shooting someone several times because they are bigger than you is not good policing - it’s bullying.

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Whatever happened to the two white males at the scene, who witnessed the shooting and who were shown on video yelling at the cops about Brown having his hands up? Did their testimony change? Were they ever subpoenaed?

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But, but, but you mean carrying a gun doesn’t make you safer. Not what the NRA would have me believe.

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The causes celebres of 2014 have mostly turned out to be big disappointments. Both the left (race and sexual violence) and the right (Benghazi, IRS) seem eager to grab onto issues to push an agenda and attempt to make the facts fit a particular narrative. I’m with the Daily Show on this…it feeds the news cycle but does more harm than good when it comes to constructive dialogue.

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What about being unarmed, injured, and running away? When facing an armed officer whose weapon is drawn?

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There are definitely cops out there who are bullies on power trips. Violently asserting one’s rights, real or perceived, against a police officer who stopped you for whatever reason it’s never a good idea, especially after his/her gun it’s out of the holster. That’s what courts are there for.

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DOJ says that is a lie.

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Yay! False equivalence!
Apparently you think that racism and sexual aren’t real issues, it’s just something “pushed” by “the left”, with roughly the same level of legitimacy as Benghazi and the IRS scandal.

Hint: you may think you’re an objective “centrist”, but you’re not.

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That’s what courts are there for

LOL.
Since you mention what the DOJ said, do you remember what they said about Ferguson’s court system? How the police picked and chose who to stop, who to search, who to fine, who to enforce fines on, the excessive warrants, the steep penalties, etc?.

Gee, is it a wonder why a certain segment doesn’t trust the courts?

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Unfortunately, some people seem to think that it made a difference whether Michael Brown had his hands up. It didn’t. The “Hands Up” campaign speaks to the reality that young, black men are being gunned down in a “justice” system where the police, or anyone who fancies themselves as such, can become judge, jury and executioner - all with the full faith and backing by the other elements of that system of “justice”. Even if the black man is the Chief of Police. (Seriously - prison inspectors in Florida can no longer talk to anyone about their inspections, including legislative oversight committees looking into record numbers of prison deaths, due to new “confidentiality” agreements and the court upheld that? And refused to grant them whistleblower status for exposing murders by guards??)

Were Michael Brown’s hands up? Doesn’t matter one bit. It was only a matter of time before the regime he lived under caused his death, either abruptly or one day, one warrant, and one jail stay for unpaid fines at a time.

“Hands UP” means that no matter how innocent and law abiding I may be, I am still considered to be a target, both literally and figuratively, to people who want to shoot someone. That is still true, whether you believe the workers on the video, taken at the time of the shooting, who were yelling at the police that he had his hands up, or Witness 40, who confirmed everything Officer Wilson said (yet was found to be lying about whether she was even in Ferguson that day, as well as in another high-profile case).

The important part is the other half of the slogan, “Don’t Shoot!” The system has become illegitimate in many people’s eyes. Until it becomes the paragon of virtue we are all supposed to give them credit for already being, the mounting injustices, directed at all but the corporate paymasters and their enforcers, will cause the downfall of the current “justice” system in some of the most abusive areas, and they know this is the inevitable consequences of their actions.

That’s why they’re buying tanks, rather than better training.

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And that, right there, is the difference between THE LIBERAL MEDIA and Fox.

You’ll never see Fox recanting like that ever.

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Systemic racism in Ferguson and elsewhere are real things that are actually happening and are harming lives and communities. Benghazi and IRS “scandals” are pure fiction driven by the right for the purposes of propaganda. There’s a huge difference between the two. One is actually a real issue, and the other is not. Trying to equate the two just delegitimizes the one issue that’s actually an issue, and it plays right into the right wing’s false narrative that you can simply hand-wave away the fact that there are people in this country literally living under an oppressive government.

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