This has been a long time coming, but assuming this results in a vote in Parliament on a new referendum, Labour will catapult over the Tories in the polls and win the next election by a solid margin regardless of whether May succeeds in stopping the proposed referendum from becoming law. This is the response that the political universe of UK politics has been crying out for. Jeremy Corbyn, for all his flaws, might end up becoming then next PM of the UK if they follow through on this reporting.
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Not a clear racist, maybe, but the policy of speedily deporting elderly Commonwealth citizens (most of them from the Caribbean) who came to Britain to provide post-war labor (google âWindrushâ) and a crackdown on asylum applications started under her time at the Home Office.
In some ways, sheâs Jeff Sessions in heels and with an overbite.
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That would be a wonderful shot in the armâthe end of the beginning.
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They werenât acting on their own behalves - they were doing it all for Vladdy.
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Brilliant, must be barking (no pun intended) to miss that one. Tuppence for your tip jar, governor.
ETA: Venmo has informed me they charge a 3 tuppence transaction fee.
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One word: Corbyn.
Even as a liberal I can say he is so out of touch, so reactionary, so unpersuasive and stuck in old ideas that he has single handedly kept Theresa May and Tories in power. They almost ousted him but he essentially led an internal Labour coup and has tight reigns on power. But when you hear him in PMQs he is SO ineffectual and weak that no one wants him in power. If he had been removed I am pretty sure Labour would have won the last election handily.
He is the Bernie Sanders of UK, except more effective at cut throat power grabs, so GREAT combination.
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Yeah I agree about Corbyn.
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Did Putin give him permission?
I suspect both sides are being whipped by fears of âKompromatâ in some form or anotherâŚ
Brexit and Trump were almost entirely Putinâs doing. It has his fingerprints all over it, and no amount of snarky, smug denial changes that fact.
They need to bring it back to the people for a referendum do-over. Considering what we know now after the fact, the level of meddling and manipulation that went on, theyâd be well-served to do that.
So would we, since Trump likely won due to Russian (and likely Saudi) interference in our election. But we can wait for Mueller, possible impeachment, and 2020, which is less than 2 years away. For us it isnât quite the end of the world. We can always vote again when the time comes. For the UK, Brexit is an altogether different animal. Itâs a point of no return. The entire idea of leaving the EU didnât even originate in the UK. Iâm quite certain of that⌠like our âborder crisisâ, it was a ginned up emergency.
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I would love them to be shown the door after a referendum re-do. Iâm pretty confident that âremainâ would win in a landslide. They created a small window where âexitâ could squeak by on a narrow margin. Youâd think something carrying potential economic and political upheaval like this would require something more than a slim and simple majority⌠and better planning ffsâŚ
Thereâs a reason certain things require a 2/3 majority in Congress. Or 2/3 of states ratifying. Things too important to leave in the hands of a brief, populist majority.
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The situation in UK makes it clear that Trump is merely a manifestation of a global problem, stemming mainly from Russian operations to destabilize the West. That we in the West were so ill-equipped to recognize and combat those operations says volumes about our current status. Weâre all, Europe and NA, being jerked around by a combination of compromised politicians and their enablers on the one hand, and a large segment of duped voters who fell victim to Russian disinformation. The best outcome in the UK is to revoke the Brexit. The best outcome for the US is to rid ourselves of the Trump/GOP chimera.
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To me, itâs not all that different from âallowingâ the GOP to remain in power after their decades-long destruction of our country, our middle-class and our ConstitutionâŚ
If we can solve our own mystery, perhaps we can offer the British some good advice. Until that day comes, weâll all just have to dream bigger and solve better.
I donât know how much was Putin and how much was the economic left-behinds happy to hear that the cause of their pain has been identified and can be killed off, but I was shocked that Brexit instantly became (and remains) a âmust-doâ task for the Conservative government, even though:
â it was a non-binding referendum with no details about how it would proceed
â it was sold by an unending pack of lies about how Britain was being taken advantage of
â it was sold by an unending pack of lies asserting that Britain would be able to negotiate to keep most of the positives of EU membership and just drop the elements it didnât like
â after the vote, the leaders of the Brexit campaign immediately ran away from any responsibility for helping carry out the Brexit process
â once it became clear that the Conservative government was set on Brexiting, we have read of companies moving portions of their London operations to other European financial centers, and of continent-based firms poaching talent from London
â we havenât been reading of firms moving to or expanding in Britain in anticipation of Brexit (the consensus is that Brexit would lower the value of the Pound, which should help manufacturing in the Brexit-loving North), possibly because the government has had its head in the sand about all the countries with which Britain only has a trade agreement via its EU membership
â it has become evident that Russia played a big part in pushing the pro-Brexit position before the vote
But, I canât explain the Trumpp vote in '16, either. All the best analyses say it was racism that put him over the top. A fucking shame. The Dems better not bend a fraction of a degree toward winning those voters back with any appeal to their racism.
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It has his fingerprints all over it, and no amount of snarky, smug denial changes that fact.
So David Cameron is a Russian agent? Heâs the one who called for the referendum in the first place and he didnât have to. Sometimes stupid political decisions have nothing to do with Putin or very overused âkompromat.â
That we in the West were so ill-equipped to recognize and combat those operations says volumes about our current status.
Not to mention the subsequent inaction and continuing helplessness, like the character of the hapless Lieutenant Gorman of âAliens.â
Not necessarily. Especially, not necessarily wittingly a Russian Agent.
We donât always know what we donât know. Who planted the Brexit bug in Cameronâs ear in the first place? I donât believe he dreamed it up himself. And if all the polls and opinions were being manipulated, then even if he wasnât being âforcedâ to go along, he happily ran along the âpoliticianâs pathâ in response to the perceived popularity of the idea.
He received the highest âSpecial Classâ honor of the âOrder of Abdulaziz al Saudâ. Which is interesting, because that particular âhonorâ keeps showing up among the Brexit/Trump folksâŚ
We can no longer ignore the Saudi involvement in both Brexit and the 2016 elections (not just in the USA by the way? Meddling was rife in numerous Western-country elections, including France and Germanyâs elections).
Having played for some years inside the âCold Warâ world of military machinations and âspycraftâ, the simple fact is that not much has changed over the past 50 years or so, in regards to âmethodsâ. The addition of Social Media and the Internet in general has introduced new methods and challenges, but the underlying operational manner isnât so different. I recognize many of the approaches.
Kompromat is actually easier to come by, and also easier to wield effectively. So itâs a very common tactic still. The whole Bezos/AMI blackmail/extortion thing is absolutely kompromat-related. Keep an eye on that one in that context. Itâll start making sense.
@sonsofares I donât know anything specifically about Cameron, but I think it applies to Brexit and the GOPâs treatment of Trump in the primaries. There was a sense of âoh, letâs just let the malcontents have their say, then when theyâre put in their place (i.e. the vote fails), weâll get back to the business of the day.â Only, of course, the referendum passed/Trump dominated the field.
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Agreed⌠Nobody believed Brexit or Trump would succeed. Iâve long held that not enough effort was put into ensuring the failure of Brexit and Trump, because no-one believed either would winâŚ
Complacency really can affect outcomes. Weâve always known that, so it was a painful lesson indeed.
Iâm not sure why people think there can be only one mystery in the world. Or only one that you get to address.
Of course Trump being in power is a mystery also, that doesnât mean you canât have an opinion about another country.
Also see this comment.
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The bigger picture now says to me they were doing it for both Vlad and MbS⌠or at least, those two were all-in on the manipulation and influence campaigns. This was true for more than just Brexit⌠it was also our 2016/18 elections, and other Western elections around 2016.
More and more itâs looking like a war between a few ultra-rich Oligarchs (by âa fewâ I mean at least a few dozen globally, from numerous countries, not just RU/SA, also USA), and the rest of the developed world. I smell a takeover (or entrenchment) effort. Itâs ugly. And pretty scary stuff.
Hereâs hoping we come through it all with our good institutions mostly intactâŚ
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GB could get as much delay as it wants, without any possibility of blockage by even a unanimously opposed EU membership, by rescinding its notice of withdrawal. Parliament can do this without another referendum.
Of course the promise would be that another notice of withdrawal would be submitted as soon as Parliament has agreed on an exit plan that the EU seems likely to accept. Needless to say, Parliament will never reach agreement on any such plan, and no future govt would ever consider putting in another notice of withdrawal even if such agreement seemed possible.