Discussion for article #241886
So children born in Texas hospitals to Texas doctors can be considered non-persons? How did the “party of life” come to that conclusion?
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Because the “party of life” refers to White lives. The Black and brown ones remain non-persons.
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Only American children are people! Illegals are illegal hence there illegal spawn are illegal un-persons and are to be considered illegal!
Of course before it’s born it’s absolutely a living baby with all rights of a person…unless it’s an illegal fetus than…uh…the mothers shouldn’t have chosen to be Mesican and illegal!
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This is beyond outrageous. Why is it that, up to 2008, matriculas were always accepted but since then, “Texas has a clear interest in protecting access” to birth certificates?? Why? Why does Texas has an interest in protecting access to birth certificates? Too many Texans or too many brown, potentially Democratic Texans?
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It might be that the Judge is really trying to protect the child. No child should have to go through life with the burden of having been born in Texas weighing them down.
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Appeal and get it out of this backwater, Bush appointed court. I only scanned the ruling, but it seems like he agrees with the plaintiffs, but gosh darn it…we just can’t have the Constitution applying to brown skinned people. He freely admit he agrees with all of the Plaintiffs legal arguments, but…argle bargle…no, no birth certificates allowed.
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The kids are unquestionably American. Doesn’t matter what you think of their Parents, denying a birth certificate to an American citizen can’t possibly be Constitutional.
Fun times when the wingnuts start coming out of the woodwork.
And heck, their leaders are from Canada and Cuba. What are they thinking?
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I think there’s a valid argument regarding accepting the Matriculas. It comes down to a privacy argument. I wouldn’t want someone showing up with a Matricula in my name and getting my child’s birth certificate. The Mexican authorities do almost no verification when they issue them. I think it requires answering a few questions and that is literally it (unless something has changed). So anyone can claim to be anyone else and get a Matricula in that other person’s name. It’s a real problem and issuing birth certificates that can be used to create identities and the like is also a problem.
I don’t know the solution, but obviously they need a workaround so parents can get these documents.
They aren’t denying birth certificates, they are denying access to birth certificates and copies with only Matriculas as ID. They’ll have to come up with a workaround.
Actually, conservatives believe that brown pre-borns aren’t babies at all. Many GOP-run states have cut or completely eliminated prenatal care for migrant women pregnant with brown pre-borns.
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Un. Fucking. Believable.
I’m so glad Hizzoner is concerned about creating Stateless persons. A birth certificate documents a few basic facts surrounding the birth. I have two children, and I don’t recall being asked for identification when either one of the was born.
Oh, wait. I’m a white guy, so obviously no ID is necessary, right?
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So these “undocumented moms” will now be unable to return to Mexico without a birth certificate for their newborn.
How stupid is this bit of fuckery?
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From my understanding, this scenario is very possible:
A Mexican couple with only Matriculas as IDs comes into an emergency room as she is giving birth. The child is born there in Texas. They just refuse to provide the couple with a copy of the birth certificate, citing that Matriculas are not valid IDs.
In such a scenario, they are most definitely denying the child their 14th Amendment rights. Indeed, they are doing much worse…by denying the child a birth certificate, they are making the child without any country, raising considerable bars to even proving they exist.
One would think that witnessing the birth of a child could, you know, exist as proof that the child was actually born in Texas. But not according to this ruling.
And then of course we have the issue of the state having to provide the parents access to some sort of ID that the State would consider valid. What this case does it try to play cute with paper trails to deny what the 14th Amendment clearly states. And the point raised is absolutely valid…this is being done for the crassest of political reason…to jump on the Trump “anchor baby” nonsense train.
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That doesn’t seem to be what the article says. The article says that that birth certificates are not being issued (presumably because the matricula does not adequately identify the parents, and the parents have to be listed. But obviously this is not a problem when a birth certificate is issued to an infant who is born to a presumed-citizen mother without state-issued identification.) And it’s impossible for a state to have an interest in not issuing birth certificates to american citizens.
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If we would give Texas back to Mexico, this problem would go away.
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Some people like Rubio and Cruz have subscribed to the notion that Latino assimilation should and does follow the pattern of those people immigrating to the U.S, from Southern and Eastern Europe (arriving from 1880-1920…for the most part).
These individuals have, for the most part, achieved white status and full assimilation.
But the Latino case poses variables not present in the case of Europeans…
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Hemispheric proximity
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Too many brown people arriving with those of olive complexion
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The tendency of Latinos to retain Spanish
There are some other variables as well.
For those interested, for years, Latinos self-identified as slightly less than one-half white, slightly less than one-half some other designation and a small amount claiming black ancestry.
Trumpism, the shenanigans shown in Texas, as well as the astonishing (relatively recent) decision to differentiate among Latinos by “race” is going to have some impact on the Latino community, promising fragmentations with some profound affects (albeit negligible for Anglos).
This kind of racism we are seeing often prompts the faint-hearted to run TOWARD the oppressor.
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Oh, and let me add one other thing. Your argument, and the Judge’s comes down to, Texas doesn’t have to accept Mexican documentation. So I should expect to see a further ruling very soon that all trade deals between Texas and Mexico are also invalid? Because if you aren’t going respect official Mexican documentation on ID, how can you accept any Mexican documents? You don’t know if the people signing them are really who they say they are.
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What are you talking about? The article SAYS no birth certificates are being given out.
In addition, if matriculas were being used, why are they not used now? What has changed on that documentation such that they are no longer acceptable? Why hasn’t a “workaround” been worked out by the state of Texas whereby they’ll accept something else? You’re just being dim and argumentative.
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No, there’s a distinction here. They are denying access to the DOCUMENT, not depriving the right of the child to be declared a U.S. citizen. Born in the U.S., equals U.S. citizen whether you hold that birth certificate in your hand or not. Not all U.S. citizens actually have birth certificates. If you are born outside the country to an American mother or military parents, you don’t get a birth certificate, you get another document all together. But that’s another discussion.
I’m not saying it’s okay, I’m saying there’s a valid legal argument here. Obviously it’s a problem because children will need some sort of identification to travel and attend school, so Texas will be forced to figure out a way forward. This judgment (and corresponding appeals) will force TX to fix this, so that’s actually a good thing. My point is that the judge is only saying Texas has the right to decide which IDs they accept to verify identification. The FBI has had problems with matriculas for some time.
The answer is for the State Dept to negotiate some sort of agreement with Mexico to actually verify identities before they issue matriculas. Maybe the answer is for the doctor to issue some sort of document at the time of birth, I frankly don’t know, but this lack of the birth certificate document DOES NOT deny these kids their citizenship.
It wouldn’t be the first time the media failed in a proper legal analysis.
The judge is arguing that Texas gets to decide if the documentation is valid. Let me repeat this… Mexico does NO VERIFICATION, other than a few quick questions, that the name issued on the matricula is in fact the person asking for it. It’s entirely reasonable to be able to verify who is asking for birth certificates.
Because I read the opinion. Again, it’s not the first time the media failed legal analysis 101.
It’s always a winning argument to go for personal insults. As I said above, it’s a real problem and Texas will have to figure out a workaround.
I’m really getting a little tired of all the aggression on this board. The lack of respect here is becoming a serious problem. The automatic assumption that there is no valid argument in something you disagree with makes me think I need a break. The selling point to a PRIME membership is always that the level of discourse is high and we learn from each other, but the commentators dragging this into the gutter are becoming a real problem.
I have no idea. EDIT: But this is the first court case heard about it, so now something will get done.
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What’s the problem here? A bay is born in the US is a US citizen, no questions involved, issue a fucking Birth Certificate.