Discussion: Israeli Strike Kills 4 Palestinian Children On Coast

It’s snark, sir.

Disappointing response. Blaming Israeli racism and inhumanity on monotheism misses by a mile. (The IDF would never miss by so large a margin, and in the case of the most recent barbaric killings, did not).

Uberjude, you are an enabler. The right wing government of Israel got into power and maintains it because its policies encourage the most extreme elements among the Palestinians to be in charge. In that way, they have an enemy to point at which strikes fear in the hearts of the Israeli population and cements their political power.

Zionism has been hijacked by a bunch of thugs in the name of the Jewish religion.

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Most definitely–Hamas controls the security forces and courts in Gaza. They have been gigged by international rights organizations for arrests of journalists and executions without trial. they also prevented UNRWA from teaching a human rights curriculum in the UN’s Gaza schools.and of course operate modesty patrols.

they have the guns, they have control.

You showed a video depicting religious Jews, so I just commented on that. had you shown a video discussing racism among chilonim, I would have been happy to address that. I think it’s a bit unfair to accuse me of “enabling” anything when you send me a video about religious extremists and I make a comment condemning religious extremists.

In addition, this makes no sense:

The right wing government of Israel got into power and maintains it because its policies encourage the most extreme elements among the Palestinians to be in charge

How does Likud get into power because its policies encourage Hamas? If you look at what happened since the '90’s, Likud has won elections whenever new bursts of Palestinian violence challenge the peace process:

1990’s–Hamas suicide bombing, Netanyahu’s first prime ministership
2001–Intifada II, Sharon wins
2009–Hamas took over Gaza, rocket attacks, Netanyahu’s second campaign.

It is not that Likud took power because they encourage Hamas; they took power because Israelis, having taken steps like the Gaza withdrawal or the Barak peace plan and having been met with suicide bombs and rocket attacks, felt that they needed security and that Likud would provide that. There’s a timeline, these things happened in the order depicted. and, of course, that’s how Likud ran its campaigns.

and this whole thing about “Jewish religion” is inaccurate. Likud is not a religious movement, Netanyahu is not religious, and neither are most of the party’s leaders.

You have been pushing the point about the warnings as a sign of Israeli moderation; it’s a little weak to now say “Well, I never said they did it every time!”

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Nice try, the religious fundamentalist rogue state killing children is Israel. BTW…you and the other supporters of Israel are losing this argument badly. Israel needs to stand on her own two feet for once.

I love seeing uberjude scratching around for a defense…the tide is starting to turn. Israel has stabbed us in the back enough times. Let her bomb children with bombs bought with their own money…not ours.

Israel and Palestine have both lost their innocence in their quest for dominance, but it is innocents that are being killed.

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Not at all–it’s a a war. the Geneva Conventions do not require that every time a shell is fired into an urban area, that civilians be warned. People here are quick to shout “War crimes!” Well, there is actually a body of law. let’s look at it (source: http://www.icrc.org/ihl/WebART/470-750073?OpenDocument)

  1. With respect to attacks, the following precautions shall be taken:

(a) those who plan or decide upon an attack shall:

(i) do everything feasible to verify that the objectives to be attacked are neither civilians nor civilian objects and are not subject to special protection but are military objectives within the meaning of paragraph 2 of Article 52 [ Link ] and that it is not prohibited by the provisions of this Protocol to attack them;

My Commentary–the objectives must be feasiblyverified as military. Meaning that your target should be military, but and you should make reasonable efforts to ascertain that.

(ii) take all feasible precautions in the choice of means and methods of attack with a view to avoiding, and in any event to minimizing, incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians and damage to civilian objects;

My Commentary–Again, there’s feasibility, and the minimum standard is not zero fatalities, it is to minimize them. If you use guided missiles as opposed to gravity bombs, if you warn civilians in the whole region to evacuate, if where feasible you warn civilians more specifically, you’ve met the standard.

(iii) refrain from deciding to launch any attack which may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated;

My Commentary–a pretty grey area. If you believe that you will kill a major Hamas leader, or destroy a major arms depot, there is no hard and fast math as to what constitutes a proportionate balance.

(b) an attack shall be cancelled or suspended if it becomes apparent that the objective is not a military one or is subject to special protection or that the attack may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated;

My Commentary–we have no idea what process goes into planning attacks, and what targets, if any, may have been rejected.

© effective advance warning shall be given of attacks which may affect the civilian population, unless circumstances do not permit.

My commentary–“unless circumstances do not permit.”

So feel free to go on about war crimes. This is what the relevant convention actually says, and, to a great extent, it seems, Israel has been doing a pretty good job of following the rules (again, if 90 percent of attacks kill no one, hard to argue that Israel isn’t making efforts to avoid casualties)

Yes, scratching desperately–it took all of five seconds to find the relevant Geneva Conventions. But please, don’t let actual international law get in the way of a good rant about war crimes.

Beg to differ. It’s an occupation, not a War. Kind of like the Nazis in Holland – who, by the way, were very fond of collective punishment as well. Oh and by the way again, collective punishment is a war crime.

“On one side is impoverished, underdeveloped Gaza, with a crushing unemployment rate, salty tap water, and war-rocked slums. On the other side is Israel, with paved roads, $7 coffees at chic cafes, and working traffic lights. The contrast between the two places is obvious, and impossible to ignore.”

Actually, what takes place in Gaza is not “occupation,” since Israel doesn’t occupy it. Israel has no legal authority in Gaza, Israel has no troops stationed in Gaza (you know, where Hamas has control).

The Netherlands, by contrast, was ruled by Germany, who appointed a Nazi administration. The laws, the police, the courts, the schools, etc. etc. were all under Nazi authority. None of those things are under Israeli authority.

Israel does blockade Gaza, much like Britain blockaded the Reich. That did not, however, make Britain the controlling power.

Returning fire from a hostile entity is not a war crime, nor does it constitute “collective punishment.”

“largely because of the effectiveness of Israel’s Iron Dome air defense system in downing incoming rockets”

Was this report sponsored by Rafael Advanced Defense Systems?

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Thanks for the hair splitting. As in a rose by any other name would smell as sweet. And double talking propaganda by any other name still stinks.

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Yet, here we have Israeli bombs all over Gaza.

Glad to see you finally admit the war-crimes of Israel

The Israelis just murder-by-missile whomever does not “follow orders”. No need to live in that smelly place.

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Blame Hamas, of course.

do you have access to some other classified source of information? Didn’t think so.

You didn’t actually say anything.