Discussion: Impeachment Divides Dems At Back-To-Back CNN Forums

Warren, a champion for her party’s more liberal wing, called for an “ultra-millionaires’ tax” on income over $50 million to help pay for free college, free child care for all children 5 and younger, free universal prekindergarten and student-debt forgiveness.

I love Dr. Professor Warren but when did she become a proponent of democratic socialism?

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Minnesota Sen. Amy Klobuchar, who has cast herself as a Midwestern pragmatist well positioned to appeal to the middle of the country, refused to embrace “Medicare for All,” free college or Trump’s impeachment.

Buh-bye, Amy.

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I certainly think investigation and building a case for impeachment is warranted. A lot of work has been done and a foundation started. I can think of nothing better than a continuous stream of impeachable information being uncovered and discussed for the next year and a half. And investigations shouldn’t be totally focused on the President but on the entire corrupt, kleptocratic administration. Start taking out the support under Trump and the fall will be quickened. Hopefully, elections will take care of the problem.

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The 2018 mid-terms were a chance for that process to begin.

Hoping is good but keep the pressure on as well!

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Dems on Disarray…

The “ever bold”, junior Senator from Vermont was typically evasive on the issue of impeaching Trump. Seems about right sine he’s never acknowledged how much his campaign benefited from the Trump/Russian chicanery in the last election cycle.

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Stick a fork Comb in her… She’s done.

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Nor has there been much acknowledgment of DNC chicanery benefiting other campaigns in regards to the nomination…

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There was never any “DNC chicanery” which resulted in B.S. losing by 4 million votes to his primary opponent. To contend otherwise is a fraud.

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Why is a disscussion of policy allways discribed as a division for Dems? It is not a negative. It is not like Dems should huddle together and come up with a lie to fool the public.

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I contend their chicanery kept elected Democrats out of the primary all together.

It’s not about Bernie. It’s about how is clear the DNC was letting it be known who the DNC supported. Not a single candidate ran that would otherwise depend on the DNC in an election ran.

Since when is there an open presidential race without multiple sitting senators running?

Since never.

By trying to not let another 2008 happen and protecting HRC, the DNC created Bernie.

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Good luck getting that thought across.

Anyone who wanted to run, could have run. There was no impediment to their running except the support that they enjoyed among the electorate. What was clear from the outset was that the eventual nominee had a base of support among the Democratic electorate that could not be overcome. What “protected” HRC was her overwhelming support, not the DNC.

As I said previously, to contend otherwise is a fraud.

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I know.

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The fact that republicans will not be on board with impeachment is a poor excuse to allow someone who has committed crimes to not be held accountable. Do you allow someone you know has murdered another person go free because you can’t find a body? People have been found guilty of murder when a body has never been found just on the preponderance of the evidence. Impeachment will get Democratics and the country access to the information that Consigliere Barr is trying to block. The information can be made reader friendly so even the most ignorant among the tRump devotees can understand.

Opinion | Impeach Donald Trump? https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/21/opinion/impeach-donald-trump.html
In this report (Muller), we see a president who doesn’t deserve to be president. We see attempts over and over to obstruct justice, which in some cases succeed.

The question is: What are we going to do about it? Obstruction of justice is a crime. If Trump committed that crime, he’s a criminal. Are we simply going to allow a criminal to sit in the Oval Office and face no consequence? Are we simply going to let the next presidential election be the point at which Trump is punished or rewarded?

It is maddening to think that we are at such a pass. But, my mind is made up: I say impeach him.

I know all the arguments against.
First, even if the House voted to impeach Trump, the Senate would never vote to convict and remove him. This is the “failed impeachment” theory.

But, I say that there is no such thing as a failed impeachment. Impeachment exists separately from removal. Impeachment in the House is akin to an indictment, with the trial, which could convict and remove, taking place in the Senate. The Senate has never once voted to convict.

So, an impeachment vote in the House has, to this point, been the strongest rebuke America is willing to give a president. I can think of no president who has earned this rebuke more than the current one.

And, once a president is impeached, he is forever marked. It is a chastisement unto itself. It is the People’s House making a stand for its people.
(.)
As for me, I’m afraid of lawlessness and the horrible precedent it would set if Congress does nothing.

On Friday, Senator Elizabeth Warren wrote on Twitter that “the House should initiate impeachment proceedings against the President of the United States.”

In another tweet she explained:

“To ignore a President’s repeated efforts to obstruct an investigation into his own disloyal behavior would inflict great and lasting damage on this country, and it would suggest that both the current and future Presidents would be free to abuse their power in similar ways.”

I worry that inaction enshrines that idea that the American president is above America’s laws. I worry that silent acquiescence bends our democracy toward monarchy, or dictatorship.

As Thomas Paine wrote in 1776, “In America the law is king.” He continued: “For as in absolute governments the king is law, so in free countries the law ought to be king; and there ought to be no other.”

Who will we let be king in this country, the president or the law?

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And risked the wrath of DNC not sandbagging them in the future.

And DNC supporting a challenger at there next election.

And a large enough minority in the party that was willing to vote for a candidate as flawed as Bernie instead on HRC.

To say you “know” otherwise is delusion.

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I respect Klobuchar’s refusal to pander and her courage to state her position. She doesn’t prevaricate and that’s a good thing. Let there be multiple, robust investigations into Trump, incIuding his personal and business finances, so that when articles of impeachment are drawn up, they cover much more than what’s contained in the Mueller report.

I tend to agree with Klobuchar that debt-free college makes more sense than free college. Warren’s proposal on Medium is brief and sloppy. It conflates debt forgiveness for loans for public and private universities with free public universities. The two are different problems and need to be tackled in different ways, lest you want state legislatures to control curriculums at state universities and to turn them into professional/vocational schools. The same thing happened with her agriculture statement which conflated seed and chemical monopolies with contract farming for animal feed. It’s amazing to me that people think Warren’s a policy whiz. Slipshod is the word I would use for the policies she’s posted on Medium (if ‘policy’ is the right word for what are basically op eds).

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Watched all five town halls and this is my take (and ranking):

Warren and Buttigieg tied

Warren — detailed policies and an easy manner in explaining how she plans to implement those policies

Buttigieg — well thought out positions, answered every question and he got some specific hard ones, rolled out his policy portal during the town hall(smart move imho)

Klobuchar — she was okay, more moderate than I like and seemed a little defensive about it. I didn’t like her relying on her daughter to polish her ‘young people’ bonafides

Harris — okay but she suffered from coming after Warren because she is so general in her policy answers. She really blew her first answer on Medicare for All. She signed onto Bernie’s bill but didn’t seem to understand it phases out private insurance in 4 years.

Sanders — typical Bernie performance with lots of ideas and phrasing but no specifics on how to implement stuff. At one point, he relied on Warren having the answers for a policy — not good when she’​​​​​​​s running against him.

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Klobuchar, like Sanders, sidestepped direct questions about
impeachment. Sanders warned that pushing too hard to remove the
president before the next election might distract from Democrats’
priorities on health care and the economy.
“At the end of the day,” he said, “what is most important to me is to see that Donald Trump is not re-elected.”

When you know you got Russian help in 2016 and didn’t denounce them in order to sabotage Clinton, you tap dance away from the subject