Discussion for article #245586
The “establishment” rebuttal is easy: Big money has brought the first woman candidate into the establishment. Whether or not that’s true, it’s playable: basically an “Uncle Tom” line.
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you remember that when The Donald is president.
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If she starts using this “first woman president” plea she will lose so fast. There are a LOT of people who think her feminism will show through once she’s in office. Notice, BHO didn’t use this tactic, and I always felt he represented everyone, equally.
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All good points except the last.
Playing the unfairly attacked woman is risky business. But she did it quite deliberately, and they let her go on for twice her allotted time. However, I don’t think she wins that battle. People know she’s the establishment candidate. A competent candidate, a caring candidate, but the establishment candidate.
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So, does Hillary’s logic suggest it was impossible for Maggie Thatcher to represent the establishment?
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I thought both did well. I will agree she treated Bernie as a serious opponent which is a switch from her previous approach. I am afraid that approach might not be as successful as she hoped because objectively Bernie came off as a serious candidate. In short treating him as a serious person might have elevated him. At the very least his call for a Democratic revival dominated the tone of the debate and her answers.
Bernie made one serious miistake. He repeated her Iraq war vote twice as often as he needed.
He got a really good hit in when he ask if the shabby treatment of the folks in Flint would have been tolerated in a white suburb.
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Trump is crashing. The next issue is Marco Rubio, a chameleon who can change his spots faster than a 17-year-old can thumb this sentence on his iPhone.
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A Hispanic will never be the GOP’s president. When it’s all said and done it will be Jeb bush. And that will be a potential problem
Grumpy But Lovable (sic) Grampa with idealistic dreams and few accomplishments is running for President. Yay!
Grandma Accused of Coordinating GrandDaughter’s Birth to benefit Grandma’s Campaign (Grandma with a record of having run for Senator, President, and oh, Grandma, the former Secretary of State) Boo!
Gramps isn’t accused of being in bed with Wall Street. Yay!
Gramps hasn’t ever needed to move beyond Vermont! Yay! Pure! Yay!
Yay Yay Yay! For the purest of the pure gramps of all time! He’s leading a revolution! Yay Yay Yay!
As for THAT other person: in bed with Wall Street, Big Banks, etc. Come on: it’s gramps (cuddly white old dude) vs Hillary, the Shillary, that Harpy, that…woman.
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I’m a Sanders supporter and was pretty impressed with Clinton tonight. Oddly, enough, not for the most of the reasons in the article. Yes, her line about the irony of being a woman candidate and being establishment was a good one. However, the reason she was good tonight is because she didn’t try to affect some odd angry persona, but was herself. She explained her positions better and in the context of the way policy or diplomacy are done in the real world. I appreciated that candor. Without going item by item, my overall impression by the end was that, yes, I could see her being President of the United States and even a very good one.
I’m still a Sanders supporter because I think voices like his are very much needed in the Democratic Party. Certain things about income inequality and the power of the rich need to drummed into the American people’s psyche. I support Bernie Sanders for that reason. I was always going to vote for Hillary if and when the time came to do that. After tonight, it’ll be easier to do so.
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Thatcher was not president.
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I wish you were right . but you are not right . The GOP/ conservatives are scared of Clinton for a reason.
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OK let me say this with out the" political correctness " . republicans hate Obama because he is black sad but true. They will hate Sanders because he a Jewish and not Israel’s favorite candidate. If it wasn’t for the democrats majority "Obamacare " would not exist today. Democrats seem to forget that change was not easy at all . Starting with the rush butt heat and his dildo heads from the very beginning sent out the memo. “I hope he fails” this crap continued for 7 years.
One person and only one person would be the GOP/conservative nightmare and that’s Hillary Clinton.
Ya have to take it step by step as a Hispanic I learned that equality does not happen over night.
Hillary Clinton is the next stepping stone. We need to stop the bleeding folks and Clinton has the experience to keep the fight and destroy the republican party. And then and only then will we be able to do what this country needs and that is to give every one the dignity and respect that we deserve as Americans.
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Nah, if anyone of that ilk Kasich.
Anyone else notice what all 5 debate headlines that are on TPM’s LiveWire right now?
Clinton On Powell, Rice…
Clinton Defends …
Clinton Hits Back At…
Clinton Rejects……
Clinton Slams…
I think TPM’s coverage of the Democratic race has been pretty evenhanded. But I watched the debate. Hillary did well, but I think they were, as in the last debate, pretty evenly matched overall. Kind of surprisingly so. But if I hadn’t watched the debate, and just read the LiveWire coverage, I would have thought Hillary had absolutely dominated. Not saying it’s intentional, just that it seems a little out of whack with what I just watched. But I am a Bernie supporter, so maybe I am just seeing it through that lens, and this really was as big a night for Hillary as those headlines would imply?
#####[Standard Disclaimer: This commenter wishes it to be known that in November he or she plans to vote for the Democratic nominee, whoever that turns out to be, and will encourage their fellow primary candidate supporters to do likewise.]
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I’m not sure that that comment was not semi snarky.
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Karl Rove ran ads against Hillary Clinton in Iowa.
Karl Rove.
The GOP isn’t scared of Bernie.
Karl Rove knows this, and those ads against Clinton were a down payment. For future employment with the next GOP nominee.
Karl Rove and every other GOPer operative is salivating at Bernie!!! Lovable Gramps!!! as the next Dem nominee.
Also too? Every minute, TWEET (in all caps, natch) and comment about Sanders if he’s the nominee? Won’t be about lovable gramps with the idealistic view of the future, and what should be.
It’ll be BERNIE IS MAO’S TWIN.
And all the words, letters to the editors, tweets, heartfelt rants, comments on Reddit, etc? The detailed explanations about WHAT DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM ACTUALLY MEANS AND WHY IT MIGHT BE GOOD FOR US (even though it might not?) AND HOW IF WE JUST EDUCATE PEOPLE?
Won’t matter a bit.
But let us all enjoy an orgy of whateverism.
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Liked for the standard disclaimer.
I, too, will vote for the Democratic nominee in November.
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Did you say Bush? Seriously? Bush?
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