Discussion: Mueller Team Believes Potential Trump Pardon Tainted Manafort's Cooperation

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The closer they get to tRump the more each of these maggots lies. Flynn? Flipped, plead guilty, cooperated. Papadopoulos? Flipped, plead guilty, cooperated. Even Cohen; even though he didn’t flip on his New York underworld buddies, he flipped on tRump.

Manafort claimed he would flip and then didn’t. We’ll see about Stone.

Oh, yes, and we’ll see about Don Jr,. Fredo, Bimbo and the Kush. I wonder how quickly they’ll flip.
Then there is one I really want to see: Melania. Any money on her changing her citizenship to Russian and declaring diplomatic immunity?

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Yep!

Can you say “witness tampering”?

I knew you could!

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The latter, if it’s clear-cut. There is no attorney-client privilege when a client asks an attorney to participate in an ongoing or future crime or fraud. The question is whether the pardon would constitute a crime or a fraud.

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Mostly true. Except when state criminal exposure is involved. A person still has a 5th Amendment privilege against testifying to facts that would result in criminal liability under state law. And since in general the 5th Amendment privilege is a blanket privilege – i.e., you get so say “I refuse to say anything at all”, that’s pretty much a get-out-of-testifying free card.

The question is whether Paulie faces any potential state criminal liability. I don’t have the answer to that.

How do you cheat on your federal taxes without also cheating on your state taxes?

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Dude was almost as much of a shit in his hearing as Kavanaugh was in his. Entitled assholes, the both of them.

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I’m not an expert on tax cheating, but depending on the laws, I imagine there are ways it could be done.

Some things, however, are federal crimes, but are not state crimes. And vice versa. Other times, either jurisdiction can prosecute. Consult your lawyer.

And the evidence just continues to pile up of obstruction and witness tampering. Doesn’t any of these stable geniuses at the White House realize that all of their communications are being followed and recorded by the NSA?

Forget the FBI, CIA and Special Prosecutor. We now have a national security entity in place that doesn’t have to follow any rules since W and his Republican Congress gave them the license to snoop on everything EVERYONE does. Donald’s minions must be putting on quite a show for them to document.

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Between Manafort, Cohen, Papadopoulos, Stone, when do Trump’s steps to taint witnesses behavior get viewed for what they are?

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In court in two years. There will be decades of crimes to try in court. The best ones being the moneylaundering for radical Islamic terrorists with Russia.

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Here’s a simple theory of what went on. Rudy Giuliani lured Manafort to break his plea deal by dangling the promise of a pardon, one that Trump never intended to give. Rudy learned what Manafort had told prosecutors. Once he learned that, Rudy dangled the pardon long enough to get Manafort to walk back his most explosive claims. Rudy then cut the cord and likely had Manafort exposed so that he would be discredited as a witness against Trump. Will the SCO find Rudy’s fingerprints on this?

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So, when does Rudy get disbarred? And jailed?

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Yeah and if you care to parse, there is almost nothing that Ghouliani or Chump has said that isn’t dripping with unintentional language of guilt. Flipping? Innocent people don’t flip on Innocent people. Innocent people don’t flip on guilty people. Guilty people don’t flip on innocent people. So that leaves you with guilty flipping on guilty. Same as the word RAT. No innocent person calls old allies Rats.

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Hey TSP I don’t think you noticed I sent you a PM a day or two ago.
About this post, I am sure it began with Chump wanting the hotel deal, but I believe the carrot was replaced with the stick long ago and Putin was using the voluminous dirt of hundreds of illegalities they know Chump has committed.

I mean, Chump was in bed with them money laundering for a decade or two. I doubt his relationship with Putin and the lower level Oligarchs and money pumpers was a 50/50 arrangement where Chump got to make demands, call shots, and take or leave offers. If Cohen and Manafort are flying half way around the world to hand deliver documents and seek audiences, my guess is Chump’s deal making days were gone and he was begging for crumbs or at the very least…don’t use the Kompromat you have on me.

It has always been my take on this, that Chump really did not want the presidency and he got cornered by winning the Primaries and then forces out of his control went and got him elected because he was much more useful as a Prez Patsy than half-bankrupt Don The Con. The only silver lining was Chump thought as Prez he would be able to arrange a We Square truce with Putin after he destroys Western Civilization.

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Not if you’re a Republican.

“And the motive, I think, is plain …” Weissmann said. “We can see what it is that he would be worried about, which is that the reaction to the idea that REDACTED would have.” The prosecutor added: “I think, negative consequences in terms of the other motive that Mr. Manafort could have, which is to at least augment his chances for a pardon.”

IOW, there’s one very big overriding reason why Manafort lied and then there also the possibility of a pardon.

REDACTED + pardon, with REDACTED being a threat and also looming larger than the possibility of a pardon. While the pardon obstruction is certainly interesting, the threat of REDACTED is even more interesting.

Except that the possibility of a pardon was not the driving reason for Manafort choosing to lie according to the transcript. It’s even quoted in the article that threat of REDACTED was what motivated him with the possibility of a pardon playing at most a peripheral role.

I didn’t see it. Still not in my notifications.

As for Chump being “coerced” into being POTUS, you may very well be right about that. He wanted his hotel in Moscow so bad that he simply went along for the ride. My only question regarding that would be what in the fucking hell is so fucking important to him that he would put himself through this entire fucking fiasco of campaigning and being fucking POTUS in order to make that fucking happen. His shit-ass hotel is more important than his shit-ass dignity? More important than his cockamamie freedom? More important than the survival of this country? What on earth is he so afraid of?

This is going to get worse. Its always required a certain amount of courage to report truth about power, even her in the good old US of A, but we typically attribute real courage to foreign correspondents in war zones.

Because of Trump’s penchant for provoking his basest base into fits of anti-media fervor, that courage is now local.

Kudos to the reporters, camerafolks and their crews for having that courage, lets all hope it isn’t tested in much more serious events. Anyone who scoffs at the idea of an anti-media riot breaking out at a Trump rally probably hasn’t watched one on the web. Trump himself is the instigator-in-chief.

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