Your point is well taken. But it’s still a false equivalency to compare a botched state execution with what ISIS is doing.
In trying to do this the outrage of both executions becomes lessened…
Noted. I’m willing to drop the death penalty subject.
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Good analysis in The Telegraph
Where does the Islamic State’s fetish with beheading people come from?
Terror group’s tactics create fear out of all proportion to its military size
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They tried bombing Tulsa in 1921, but black people still prevailed.
Did you know The GAP Band takes their name from Greenville, Archer and Pine streets in Tulsa in honor of the race riots? Adds a whole new meaning to the song “You Dropped A Bomb On Me”.*
*fixed
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If it was a violation of the 8th Amendment that is an opinion not a fact. It is your opinion that the execution in Oklahoma was cruel and unusual. It is not a fact. You don’t know if the executed was in any physical pain, so it is your opinion that it was cruel.
In this case, the person killed was in great pain, the act was cruel and unusual and the person killed was not a convicted murderer, so equating these two cases is stupid and diminishes the evil of this murderer.
Then the questions are: what we should do, and what is the range of possible outcomes that might flow from that course of action?
I would remind you that, especially in the Middle East, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
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I would like to also call for this ISIS propaganda picture to be removed because they do not deserve the airtime.
Replace it with a picture not taken by animals, thank you.
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Conversely, your opinion that there wasn’t an 8th Amendment violation is just that, an opinion not a fact. It is your opinion that everything went well in Oklahoma, and you take that position before there has even been an investigation. I am not comparing capital punishment, per se, with the beheading, just the fact that the officials involved seem to take great pleasure in the fact that the execution took so long. It is also your opinion that the person who was killed was in great pain. Unless you were there, anything you have “heard” is merely hearsay.
This death penalty argument is way off topic and bestows way too much legitimacy on IS (that is any).
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Since news of ISIS’s deplorable behavior promoting terrorist propaganda through this barbaric act, MSNBC hasn’t put on one show so far that has any measurable push-back against militarism and allusions to boots on the ground all day. Just so you know, all those shows that people consider left-of-center are anything but that all day on that cable channel. In fact, they are repeating exactly what they did in journalistic malpractice in the lead up to the war in Iraq. They have many on that try to hedge their bets, but the same armchair generals, foreign policy “experts” that have dubious funding sources and private contracting ties, former ambassadors, chickenhawk Dems and Repubs alike, opinion-assholes, and those going way out of their way to point to “the no strategy position” of the President have been non-stop, relentless and unrelenting. When you couple that with Faux and CNN, Its no wonder how we got into Iraq in the first goddamn place and why we’re stuck in this residual morass today.
Every action by terrorists is met with a political bullshit assessment by these same talking head “experts”, pointing to the fallacy that its the President that controls everything that happens abroad. Its fucking ridiculous. If we had a decent 4th estate that worked just as hard against this type of fucking propaganda and pitiful groupthink as we did during WW2, whose loyalty was more towards the country than the political operatives they pay to come on as “contributors” with their canned opinions, we’d have a far better understanding and thoughtful response to these types of atrocities. Instead we give the terrorists the attention they so undeservedly crave. Now that’s just stupid.
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I don’t know if it’s so much that the Middle Eastern “base” prefers a Islamicist caliphate to secular rule; rather, I think it’s because it is the religious organizations that are better-positioned to jockey into power when there is a power vacuum, since they already have a base of operations and are able to mobilize and consolidate power, and since those societies typically lack political organizations or democratic infrastructure that could present a counterforce against theocratic rule…
Good God, people, forget about the death penalty. This is a serious situation(the death penalty is not a major issue in my opinion.)
We have radical terrorists (devout Islamists) on the move. This makes Putin look like Doris Day.
We have to have a serious debate an whether or not this is a situation that calls for the use of tactical nuclear weapons. I didn’t say use them (which I would) I said debate about it. Personally, I think that if a few of these areas were left flat, warm, and glow in the dark, even the promise of multiple virgins will lose their attractiveness to these idiots. If not, just use some more.
Yes, keep the bombings and strafe up. Don’t forget this is a religious war going on. Slowly strange bedfellows are taking back lost territory to the IS. Keep up with Al Jezeera, they have the most up to date info on what is going on there.
I know you are supposed to be a clever snarker. Really, however, you post more like a high school freshman who is trying to be oh, so amusing. Just ask yourself this:
What does my post do to advance thoughtfulness or objectivity?
Or failing that, have I given anyone a good laugh with my great wit?
As to the first, I would have to say that your posts are not even sophomoric (that’s why I labeled you a freshman, btw)
And as to your level of wit, I’d say you’re halfway there.
Hey, did you catch my snark? Did you? Did you?
To Candirue–if you look at the maps, they are holding the transit routes from Iraq to Syria. They rest is apparently a vast desert. If the fighters in Iraq can get those back IS is on the run.
Even if it were exactly as you stated, what you said is effectively the same thing that I said.
In a power vacuum, by definition there is no democratic infrastructure or any other political organization sufficient to keep peace. The people on the ground have to make those organizations. The question is “What kind of political organizations do they make?”
It seems like absent influence from some non-Islamic entity, propping up a strongman / king, they make an Islamic caliphate of some sort.
And that would make us better than them…how?
Oh, and what fence is Obama on? The one that you jump off of when McGrumpy sings “Bomb, bomb, bomb…Iran” or when Lindsey Graham bawls that we need WAR?
This is a hugely complicated mess…and war-mongering neo-cons are to some extent responsible for its origins, so they need to STFU and let the adult here (Obama) figure out what to do. No President in recent history has had so many facets to evaluate. And unlike many that I could name, he actually has the good of the country in mind as he is deciding what to do.
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You need to learn to differentiate between snark and satire, which are quite different from one another.
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You’ve got this asshole O’Hanlon guy from Brookings on MSNBC believing that Congress should approve a 1/2 billion dollars to arm Syrian rebels right now. WTF! Isn’t that the John McWar line? That is so absurd. Congress had their chance back a year ago to approve that money and wouldn’t as I recall. Why? Because those Syrian fucking rebels were inseparable from who ISIS is today, and giving them money is like giving money that will end up funding an Al Qaeda terrorist-type group of thugs once again. And it will most assuredly come back to bite us in the butt as it did when we funded Al Qaeda back in the day. It amazes me how many “foreign policy experts” want to fight these asinine proxy wars, where coincidentally American soldiers would be back on the ground training these fuckers all over again. These rebel fighters have no loyalty to the West and that’s not about to change. They want arms and they want money to keep going…that’s it. They get most of that from the theocrats in Saudi Arabia and Qatar as it is. It didn’t work before but hell, let’s keep doing the same stupid shit over and over again just to look like we’re doing something huh? Mr. President…as you say, don’t do stupid shit. ISIS isn’t threatening our shores no matter what the hair-on-fire bloviators are saying. And when and if they do, we’re more than capable of defending ourselves here at home.
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