This thread is the lead article on the front page. After several hours it has 20 comments. I think many TPMers are like me. They are numb with really nothing to say.
We might well be living in a world where this is a monthly (weekly?) occurrence.
Over seventy French families will never be the same again. My head bows for them.
Mine too. Right now more than anything I can only grieve for the lost.
Well, Iâm a âlifelong liberalâ as well, leftist to my core, and I have to say that ISIS and yes, radical Islam, are abhorrent to everything that I believe in. And I donât know what the answer to this kind of violence is, other than to say that âprayersâ and âthoughtsâ and other forms of grief and empathy, including changing oneâs Facebook icon and buildings lighting up in blue and white and red, arenât cutting it. I have no desire to go down any kind of Trumpian path, but at this point Iâd be more than happy to see NATO wipe out the âcaliphateâ that continues to inspire these attacksânot to mention the war crimes they have committed against women, gays, people of other religions, etc. No, that wonât resolve this incredibly messy, complicated conflict, but it will at least remove the sanctuary of the organization that urges these attacks. If they continue, I guarantee you that Trump and all of the parallel Trumps that are emerging or have emerged in Europe will come to power, and it wonât be pretty.
Itâs incredibly awful that so few evil bastards can wreak so much havoc on the world.
Enough is enough! I have had it with these motherfucking sick fucks on this motherfucking planet!
Yes, Iâm absolutely fed up with idiots and violent lunatics acting in the name of God, whether theyâre trying to deny birth control to women or mowing down innocent people with guns and trucks.
So no birthday card from you this year?
My heart is heavy and goes out to the people of Nice and France. My heart also yearns for a peaceful world, but my brain just says âfuckâ over and over. I will hold on to my heart for dear life.
At this point, Iâm not sure what it would take to move NATO in that direction â but you are right: ISIS needs to be wiped off the face of the earth, given no safe sanctuary. Before we are ever successful at doing that, though, weâthe Westâneed to take a long hard look at our own history meddling in the affairs of anything in that region ⊠and thatâs one hella lot of tangled up yarn. I sincerely believe that until our side of the world (those of us who have engaged in the fucking up of that region) start to make some serious inroads at rectifying some of the damage weâve wrought, weâre likely never to experience any real peace. Thereâs only but so far folks can be pushed before they fight back â and hard. I hate it, but the next couple generations of Westerners are in for a very bumpy ride (not to even bring in the topic of climate change on the global scale). Donât misunderstand me â the Middle East has been fucked up in its own ways for many centuries, but then we stuck our fingers in all corners and screwed them up even more. We need to disentangle ourselves from that regionâyes, Israel, you heard me rightâbut try to make amends and friends as we depart. Yes, we should stand by Israel, but not tolerate their apartheid-like ways anymore. One way to do this is renewable energies. We needed to have done this like yesterday. Had Ronnie Reagan not dismantled everything President Jimmy Carter had started with regards to renewables, weâd be oh so much further down that long road, weâd have a lot better leverage at getting out.
Anyway, I do hear you. I understand â and, yes, NATO could really go a long way ⊠if they could (collectively) bring themselves to do it.
Youâll let us know when you come up with a rational approach, wonât you? I know I speak for everyone here when I say we are all waiting with bated breath for your oh so rational thoughts. No. Not really.
Shorter Idiot: Letâs stop Trump from winning by adopting his worst policies. That way we can turn it into a real a Crusade rather than the world against a ruthless but barbaric cult.
I expect Bose may send a contribution to Hillary in your honor.
Eh, fuck you and the horse you rode in on. You can find a fascist of every religion - or none at all - if you look around. You gonna ban Christians coming here because of the Holocaust, or slavery, or the slaughter of the Native Americans? Jews because of Israeli apartheid? Zen Buddhists because of the Rape of Nanking? Hindus because of the Hashimpura massacre? Pretty selective to find a whole religion to be beyond the pale because of the actions of a few.
The land area controlled by ISIS has been almost cut in half. That will continue until the Caliphate is gained. This will solve nothing because the remnants will go underground and terrorism will continue. Wiping out the people currently living under ISIS control is both unjust and counterproductive: those who have already fled would now have two targets.
Christian Sharia in this country is already costing lives.
Agreed, beattycat. President Bush set the Middle East on fire back in 2003 with the invasion of Iraq (an invasion I strenuously opposed), but now that weâve broke it, we own it, for the time being, anyway, especially given the weakness of the Iraqi military (another situation for which you can give the Bush admin a whopping share of the credit). All of these mini 9/11s that ISIS has pulled off in Iraq, Turkey, France, and the U.S. (if you count Orlando and San Bernadino) amount to acts of war⊠not to mention the mass-execution war crimes theyâve clearly committed against the populations of Iraq and Syria. We canât just âcarpet-bombâ ISIS a la Ted Cruz; itâs a far more complicated task than that, but at this point Iâd say we do need to eliminate any physical territory that ISIS can claim as a caliphate or sanctuary. Winning the cultural/propaganda side of things is the trickier part.
Trump is an utter disaster along those lines.
Iâm by no means advocating âwiping out the people currently living under ISIS control.â In fact, Iâm arguing that we liberate them, since most reports indicate that people living under such control are deeply unhappy, if they havenât already been executed for being gay, defending historic relics, etc. And my opposition to Christian-right stupidity and repression in this country doesnât mean that I canât detest and oppose whatâs being done to women, gays, and people of other religions in ISIS-held territory. Iâm aware that weâve been making progress against ISIS, but itâs been far too incremental.
One of the nicest nights of my life was being in Paris for Bastille Day. My friend and I went from one bal de pompiers (a public dance sponsored by the fire houses) in one arrondissement to another. The last one found us by St. Sulplice where we danced a little late, with Senegalese, Tunisians, Malians, Vietnamese, and so on. The cab taking us to the place we were staying in the banlieue (suburb) was getting expensive, and the RER (the suburban commuter train) had stopped, so I told the cab driver to stop the car so we could walk. The driver, a Cambodian who had fled the Khmer Rouge, turned off the meter, and said, " Ca, câest pour le patron, ceci est de moi" (ThatÂŽs for the boss; this is from me) and drove us all the way home. He did that because on that night âlibertĂ©, equalitĂ©, et fraternitĂ©â was real, and we were all cityoens du monde. I weep for the ideal of common humanity that the fascists tonight, and others like them, would so like to destroy.
[quote=âcitizentompaine, post:36, topic:40508â]
Iâm aware that weâve been making progress against ISIS, but itâs been far too incremental.
[/quote]Unfortunately, Putin and Russia have been thorns in our side here. If Putin hadnât been such a fucking jerk with the Crimea and so friendly to Syriaâs murderous dictator, the world might very well be further along on this front.
No, no, youâve misunderstood my regard. Iâm always impressed with sheer honesty, no matter what it reveals.
Well at least it is progress rather than moving backwards rapidly with Trump.