After Announcing Impeachment Charges, House Dems Throw Trump A Trade Bone

[jtx]

It is either a good deal or a bad deal, it really shouldnt have a damn thing to do if it throws a bone to Trump or not.

[khaaannn]

I am seeing a lot of whining here by people who seem to forget that there is a Government Shutdown looming in the distance and this Trade Deal is a minor reworking of the existing NAFTA.

The Democrats can walk and chew gum at the same time and have decided it’s in the nation’s interest to go along with this as it’s not about OPTICS, it’s about keeping the Nation running and not destroying the economy for a pointless short-term Political Win (and in the process giving Trump ammunition to use against them.)

Grow up already. You don’t defeat the enemy by becoming him.

[jep07]

Kinda makes Dems look calculating and superior, doncha think?
At least to the general public.
Anything Dems do is anathema to the Trumpladytes, so this will encourage another in the long string of existential struggles for them, as they try to spin it as something nefarious.

[castor_troy]

This is a huge victory for Trump

Oh, dear lord. Why don’t you just go over to breitbart, 99.95% of your posts belong in that fantasyland.

[bluinmaine]

Is this Treaty that good for Dems to give Bone Spurs a BIG victory like this ?

It’s not much different than before. the name change is what trump wanted. Now it’s another one of his greatest feats. lol Wanna catch the biggest fish? chuck in a few little ones every now and then to feed it. Then when you want to catch him, put a hook in one and then reel him in, cook him and enjoy. lol

[demosthenes59]

This makes zero sense. Why help Trump? This trade bill is almost the same as NAFTA, which is still in effect.

Just kill it.

[castor_troy]

This makes zero sense.

…Government shutdown in 10 days… All the pieces are linked together. Give something here to get something elsewhere. A minor “win” for trump here may well be the difference between budget bills getting passed or not.

[paul_lukasiak]

It is either a good deal or a bad deal, it really shouldnt have a damn thing to do if it throws a bone to Trump or not.

True. The problem isn’t the deal. The problem is the messaging.

No one has any idea why the Dems were holding up the bill – or what they’ve accomplished by doing so. The Dem leadership allowed Trump to define the issue, with no effective pushback.

As a result, Trump is going to get all the credit for “getting rid of NAFTA and replacing it with something much better” – and it doesn’t matter that its not true. Dem leadership failure has left a complete void where a counter-narrative should have been, and in the absence of a strong (not to mention, true) counter-narrative, Trump phony narrative will prevail.

[dchoubak]

trump* signed the document so it’s automatically infinitely better…I assume that’s the reason why he thinks so.

[rucleare]

Minutes from today’s TPM thread:
“The presence of two gnats (@georgeh and @paul_lukasiak) was noted. Members briefly took evasive action, then moved the agenda along.”

[emiliano4]

These sports metaphors gave us Gingrich and people around me have learned not to use them when discussing complex political matters affecting people’s lives.

[paul_lukasiak]

Oh, dear lord. Why don’t you just go over to breitbart, 99.95% of your posts belong in that fantasyland.

The above is a prime example of why Trump has not been thrown out of office already – and still has a good shot at being re-elected. The inability to recognize Trump’s successes – and how the Democratic leadership’s strategy has lead to those victories – blinds them to nature of the threat that the country is confronting.

Instead, we get lemming-like, obsequious adherence to the Democratic Leadership line – with no thought whatsover. The leadership position can turn on a dime, and the lemmings turn with it.

Bottom line. Trump promised to get rid of NAFTA, and force Mexico and Canada to give us a better deal. And now, Trump can claim victory, because the Dem leadership has ZERO effective response to Trump’s messaging juggernaut.

This makes zero sense. Why help Trump? This trade bill is almost the same as NAFTA, which is still in effect.

this makes perfect sense – 14 months ago, when Trump announced the “USMCA”. It was at that point that the Dems needed to go on offense, call the deal “NAFTA 2” or “NAFTA Jr” and emphasize that the deal wasn’t that different from NAFTA, and wasn’t an improvement for american workers.

But because the Dems didn’t lay that groundwork, because the leadership is completely incompetent when it comes to responding to Trump’s mastery of messaging and narrative, the option you suggest would be counter-productive. In “real” terms, its nearly identical to NAFTA. But its now called “USMCA” – its not NAFTA, its branded as something completely different.

[meri]

What flavor of dumbfuckery inside the Democratic consultant class thinks playing happy families and singing Kumbaya with a President who lacks every moral and political scruple works to motivate their base?”

Probably the ones who know that anything other than 110% support of everything the Democrats do will be painted as “helping Trump win”, even when the actions being taken by the Democrats is to literally give Trump a win.

[castor_troy]

The inability to recognize Trump’s successes – and how the Democratic leadership’s strategy has lead to those victories – blinds them to nature of the threat that the country is confronting.

Yup. Those massive successes which lead to a tsunami in 2018. Those massive successes where personal appearances couldn’t pull two governorships in friendly states. Those massive successes which led to being only the third President who will be impeached.

Truly. Massive.

[rick]

Still another way would be that you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.

Is this how you behave in real life? Respond to reasoned argument with personal insults?

Such as that the government is due to shut down again next week, this is most certainly part of the bargaining chips on the table to get the budget crap passed.

I see you take “bargaining chips” as mandatory and somehow think that this announcement had to be made today.

But that’s because you don’t know what you’re talking about.

[rick]

I see the ad hominem caucus is well attended today.

[castor_troy]

But that’s because you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Apparently better than you do. You said that Team Pelosi didn’t know what they were doing, so perfectly fair rejoinder. It was going to be announced anyway very shortly, no reason to not juxtapose it with the impeachment, reinforcing the fact that they’re just doing their job, whether it’s passing legislation or impeaching a president.

[tpr]

And he snatched it like a dog?

I see what you did there.

We’ll see how much leash Putin lets him have.

[rick]

The Democrats can walk and chew gum at the same time and have decided it’s in the nation’s interest to go along with this as it’s not about OPTICS,

But elections are about optics, and success in the next election has a lot more to do with keeping the impeachment story clear. It really wouldn’t have hurt to keep this announcement held back for one more day.

Honestly, a lot of the time I think Dem leaders aren’t really trying that hard to win and hold power. What was it Biden said the other day? Oh, right. “We need Republicans”. I guess he needs Republicans.

It’s one thing to “walk and chew gum”. It’s another thing to piss into the wind.

[tena]

I really think this was one of the smartest things Nancy has done. It’s a big message to the country that the Democrats are doing their job and that they are willing to work with him when he’s not being a traitor.

I think it’s great optics.